New Talk Pages
Den här diskussionen fortsatte här: New Talk Pages #2
DiskuteraNew features
Bara medlemmar i LibraryThing kan skriva.
1timspalding
As you've probably noticed, "Talk" has been updated with a slightly different design. Some highlights:
1. The main talk page now presents "Groups" and "Topics" in two columns. You can quickly change back to how it was before, however, by clicking the left arrow next to the word "Topics."
2. Talk and topic pages are now fully mobilized. This is, as usualy, one of the main gains we're looking for: You can use Talk on your iPhone or Android now, and it won't suck. I'll follow up with some screenshots in a moment.
3. Talk is now more accessible--another LT2 feature generally.
4. As with other LT pages, we have changed the site font and the size is somewhat larger. I don't know about you, but I always looked at LibraryThing enlarged. We also added some white space.
5. On the main topic page rows are now a single, easy link to the topic wherever you have gotten to. This is a change from before, where there was a text link for the topic's top and another for the last message you've read in the topic. Support for this change was almost unanimous on This Topic.
6. Starring and ignoring have moved to the top right of topic pages, in keeping with our new policy of putting most simple actions there. Stars have moved to the left of the main Talk page.
I am SURE this will feel weird at first. But this is hardly a radical change. Let us know what you think, but also give it some time.
Quick Caveats:
1. We removed the sorting by other column heads—Group, Topic, New/Total. We are mulling this, frankly. Usage stats show that sorting by anything other than last message is almost never used. And members getting confused when they click a header by mistake and everything goes "weird" is a constant problem. But some have already raised this as an issue and we are open to bringing it back.
1. The main talk page now presents "Groups" and "Topics" in two columns. You can quickly change back to how it was before, however, by clicking the left arrow next to the word "Topics."
2. Talk and topic pages are now fully mobilized. This is, as usualy, one of the main gains we're looking for: You can use Talk on your iPhone or Android now, and it won't suck. I'll follow up with some screenshots in a moment.
3. Talk is now more accessible--another LT2 feature generally.
4. As with other LT pages, we have changed the site font and the size is somewhat larger. I don't know about you, but I always looked at LibraryThing enlarged. We also added some white space.
5. On the main topic page rows are now a single, easy link to the topic wherever you have gotten to. This is a change from before, where there was a text link for the topic's top and another for the last message you've read in the topic. Support for this change was almost unanimous on This Topic.
6. Starring and ignoring have moved to the top right of topic pages, in keeping with our new policy of putting most simple actions there. Stars have moved to the left of the main Talk page.
I am SURE this will feel weird at first. But this is hardly a radical change. Let us know what you think, but also give it some time.
Quick Caveats:
1. We removed the sorting by other column heads—Group, Topic, New/Total. We are mulling this, frankly. Usage stats show that sorting by anything other than last message is almost never used. And members getting confused when they click a header by mistake and everything goes "weird" is a constant problem. But some have already raised this as an issue and we are open to bringing it back.
2timspalding
Here's an example of Talk on mobile before vs. after.
3Collectorator
Medlemmem har stängts av.
4rosalita
>1 timspalding: I was going to complain that while I like the general look, the type size on the topics list page was much too big. But then I remembered I have LT set to 130% zoom — now that I've reverted to 100% it looks great!
I LOVE the separation of Group and Topic, but could you make at least the Group column sortable, so that all threads from the same group could appear together. I'd still want to sort by Latest Messages sometimes, though, so if can't choose which column to sort on, I'd rather have Latest Messages sort.
I LOVE the separation of Group and Topic, but could you make at least the Group column sortable, so that all threads from the same group could appear together. I'd still want to sort by Latest Messages sometimes, though, so if can't choose which column to sort on, I'd rather have Latest Messages sort.
5timspalding
>3 Collectorator: We have not changed that yet. We shall we doing so soon.
I was going to complain that while I like the general look, the type size on the topics list page was much too big. But then I remembered I have LT set to 130% zoom — now that I've reverted to 100% it looks great!
Right. I also looked at Talk and most of LT zoomed in. Fundamentally LT's fonts have been very small—an oddity considering our demographics lean old. They remain smaller than average online, but we have scaled them up slightly.
I was going to complain that while I like the general look, the type size on the topics list page was much too big. But then I remembered I have LT set to 130% zoom — now that I've reverted to 100% it looks great!
Right. I also looked at Talk and most of LT zoomed in. Fundamentally LT's fonts have been very small—an oddity considering our demographics lean old. They remain smaller than average online, but we have scaled them up slightly.
6rosalita
>5 timspalding: I have a 27-inch 5K Retina display iMac so fonts in general always look smaller. LT was teensy!
7lycomayflower
On my laptop, if I zoom in past 110%, the right-hand column (where Star and Ignore are) disappears, and there's no indication that there's any more page over there that I'm missing. I'd expect there to be a slider at the bottom of the page?
8katiekrug
Getting used to the changes, but I don't hate it. and it looks good on my Android phone.
One thing, though - I can't seem to "Preview" a post - when I click on it, nothing happens. On my laptop, using Firefox...
One thing, though - I can't seem to "Preview" a post - when I click on it, nothing happens. On my laptop, using Firefox...
9laytonwoman3rd
I don't like it, the same way I don't like what Facebook has done to its look. I feel like I accidentally took a large print book from the library. I understand needing to make the site useable on phones, but I'm still a PC girl, and I don't like feeling shuffled off, if you know what I mean. Highlighting something to cut or copy doesn't work well....it's so faint as to be nearly invisible.
Is "New Features" supposed to be three lines, with "Features" broken in the middle on the right-hand column? That's how it looks on my PC display at 100%.
Is "New Features" supposed to be three lines, with "Features" broken in the middle on the right-hand column? That's how it looks on my PC display at 100%.
10conceptDawg
>7 lycomayflower: When you zoom a page it changes the overall perceived width of the page for the browser. The browser then tells itself that it only has X amount of relative "pixels" to work with (now fewer than it had before). The new LT pages take device size into consideration and remove elements in the page so that the rest of the content doesn't get smushed together—or worse, overlapped.
The right sidebar just gets moved to the bottom of the screen at smaller screensizes and that's what you're simulating when you zoom in.
Eventually, I'd like the action area—where the buttons are—to not move to the bottom, but to the top...I just haven't tackled that problem yet.
The right sidebar just gets moved to the bottom of the screen at smaller screensizes and that's what you're simulating when you zoom in.
Eventually, I'd like the action area—where the buttons are—to not move to the bottom, but to the top...I just haven't tackled that problem yet.
11timspalding
>7 lycomayflower:
So I'm concerned it happens so "early" for you. Do you have your browser set to fill your screen, or do you use only part of it? Do you have a very small monitor? Can you tell us more about your setup?
So I'm concerned it happens so "early" for you. Do you have your browser set to fill your screen, or do you use only part of it? Do you have a very small monitor? Can you tell us more about your setup?
12amanda4242
First thought: "Wow, that is horrendously ugly!"
More constructive criticism:The smaller font for who & when last posted makes the other font seem disproportionately large, and gives that ransom note feel.
The side bars in the threads feel really intrusive and make the post feel cramped together. Do we really need the stuff on the left to be displayed in a thread?
The contrast between read and unread topics in the Talk tab isn't great. The contrast is much better now.
Congratulations on making Talk look great on mobile devices!
More constructive criticism:
Congratulations on making Talk look great on mobile devices!
13lilithcat
I really hate the size.
"I don't know about you, but I always looked at LibraryThing enlarged." *
I never did, and I had to zoom out three times to get the page back to a reasonably sized font.
The new one takes up way to much territory.
* Why aren't italics working?
(Also, as I mentioned in the other thread, on Firefox, highlighting text to copy is suddenly extremely faint, barely noticeable.)
"I don't know about you, but I always looked at LibraryThing enlarged." *
I never did, and I had to zoom out three times to get the page back to a reasonably sized font.
The new one takes up way to much territory.
* Why aren't italics working?
(Also, as I mentioned in the other thread, on Firefox, highlighting text to copy is suddenly extremely faint, barely noticeable.)
14conceptDawg
>9 laytonwoman3rd: Can you tell me more about the "New Features" thing? Is this within a talk thread?. For now, I'm assuming you mean the little "Group Information" box on the right sidebar.
That's a simple text block with an image. We can't do a lot about where text breaks on individual screens, lots of things can influence that (OS, font selection, sizing, zoom, etc.).
That's a simple text block with an image. We can't do a lot about where text breaks on individual screens, lots of things can influence that (OS, font selection, sizing, zoom, etc.).
15mahsdad
>8 katiekrug: It might have been a transient issue. I just tried it and it worked for me. Laptop/Chrome
17amanda4242
>13 lilithcat: I never had to zoom in, either. Now I feel the need to zoom out.
18katiekrug
>15 mahsdad: - Nope, still happening. It's not a huge issue and I'm sure they'll get it fixed at some point. I don't want to add to the Chorus of Hate ;-)
19mahsdad
>14 conceptDawg: I think she's just talking about the square image you are using for the New Features Group.
It shows as
N E W
F E A T
U R E S
It shows as
N E W
F E A T
U R E S
20quondame
I used the ordering "unread/message" to keep the most unread at the top so I could more easily follow discussions in the thread by going through the message heavy ones first. Less scrolling involved.
21foggidawn
I like it better than the recent Facebook redesign, I'll give you that. :-D
I haven't played around with it on my phone yet; I may like it considerably more if it improves that experience as much as you hope and intend.
I haven't played around with it on my phone yet; I may like it considerably more if it improves that experience as much as you hope and intend.
22mahsdad
>18 katiekrug: Yeah, change is hard. :)
I did just notice the red on my own posts, that's an interesting idea. What would be really cool would be to be able to flag/star certain people so on a very talkative thread like we have over in the 75, it would make my friends posts stick out
I did just notice the red on my own posts, that's an interesting idea. What would be really cool would be to be able to flag/star certain people so on a very talkative thread like we have over in the 75, it would make my friends posts stick out
23LolaWalser
I'm getting used to this as I type; looks like a nice job overall.
>16 lilithcat:
+1
I'd get rid of it altogether tbh, but even just paling it out to a gentler shade would help.
>19 mahsdad:
But that's just the group pic, it always looked that way?
>16 lilithcat:
+1
I'd get rid of it altogether tbh, but even just paling it out to a gentler shade would help.
>19 mahsdad:
But that's just the group pic, it always looked that way?
24AnnaClaire
Obviously I'm still adjusting, but there's one change that I so far do not like. On the old Talk page, I would open topics into new tabs using CTRL+click. Trying this in the new version -- at least on Firefox in Windows -- works the same as an ordinary link-click. The only current work-around is to right-click and select from the menu, which is at best extra work.
25timspalding
>23 LolaWalser:
Indeed. But redesigning a UI is like redesigning a garden—you move rocks and the ants that were always there are suddenly noticed.
Indeed. But redesigning a UI is like redesigning a garden—you move rocks and the ants that were always there are suddenly noticed.
26timspalding
>24 AnnaClaire:
Obviously I'm still adjusting, but there's one change that I so far do not like. On the old Talk page, I would open topics into new tabs using CTRL+click. Trying this in the new version -- at least on Firefox in Windows -- works the same as an ordinary link-click. The only current work-around is to right-click and select from the menu, which is at best extra work.
I completely agree, but this is an error. We *thought* we had worked around this. Can you post your browser and OS so we can fix it?
Obviously I'm still adjusting, but there's one change that I so far do not like. On the old Talk page, I would open topics into new tabs using CTRL+click. Trying this in the new version -- at least on Firefox in Windows -- works the same as an ordinary link-click. The only current work-around is to right-click and select from the menu, which is at best extra work.
I completely agree, but this is an error. We *thought* we had worked around this. Can you post your browser and OS so we can fix it?
27katiekrug
Android phone: It won't let me post. I was able to click Edit on an already posted comment, but then I couldn't save, preview, or cancel.
28conceptDawg
>24 AnnaClaire: That should not be the case. I'll check and see if I can catch that.
29conceptDawg
>27 katiekrug: Looking into this. It's not the case on all Android phones...which makes it even more fun! :)
30amanda4242
>26 timspalding: I'm having the same trouble as >24 AnnaClaire: on a Chromebook running Chrome Version 85.0.4183.131
31katiekrug
>29 conceptDawg: - I really don't envy you all! Thanks for all the hard work.
32AnnaClaire
>26 timspalding:
I'm running Firefox 81.0.2 on a Windows 10 laptop. But it's also reported elsewhere, >30 amanda4242:
I'm running Firefox 81.0.2 on a Windows 10 laptop. But it's also reported elsewhere, >30 amanda4242:
34lycomayflower
>11 timspalding: It's a laptop with a 13 inch screen. I'm using Chrome.
By setting the browser to fill the screen, do you mean like toggling with F11? I didn't. I just tried it now, and it makes no difference set to 125%. The right bar still gets pushed to the bottom either way.
By setting the browser to fill the screen, do you mean like toggling with F11? I didn't. I just tried it now, and it makes no difference set to 125%. The right bar still gets pushed to the bottom either way.
35amanda4242
Det här meddelandet har tagits bort av dess författare.
36lorax
timspalding (#1):
Slightly? The main page looks so bizarre I thought I was having a CSS issue. That or that I somehow got into a 1995-era forum. I'll get used to it, I suppose, but I can't imagine seeing "a giant blob of whitespace with super-faded colors" as an improvement.
Slightly? The main page looks so bizarre I thought I was having a CSS issue. That or that I somehow got into a 1995-era forum. I'll get used to it, I suppose, but I can't imagine seeing "a giant blob of whitespace with super-faded colors" as an improvement.
37lorax
Looking a bit more:
The red as an accent color, which I see to mark my posts and starred topics, is horrible. It screams "SOMETHING IS WRONG THIS IS BROKEN", not "This is important or different". Ugh.
The red as an accent color, which I see to mark my posts and starred topics, is horrible. It screams "SOMETHING IS WRONG THIS IS BROKEN", not "This is important or different". Ugh.
38amanda4242
I just noticed the "Spam?" link isn't there anymore. Will it be coming back?
39ScarletBea
I'm one of those that also thinks the font looks huge (just read it on my laptop) - on the main page; inside a thread it's not so bad.
I suppose I'll get used to it, but what I don't like much is the difference in font size between the Group/Topic/Total columns and then the Last Message information.
I mean, look at the empty space in the Topic and Total columns, can't we use that to make all the columns more even and get all of them on the same font size?
I'm also not keen on the dark red highlight whenever I move my mouse, it's super-contrasting with the calmer hues of the page (and I say this as a person who loves red hehe)
I suppose I'll get used to it, but what I don't like much is the difference in font size between the Group/Topic/Total columns and then the Last Message information.
I mean, look at the empty space in the Topic and Total columns, can't we use that to make all the columns more even and get all of them on the same font size?
I'm also not keen on the dark red highlight whenever I move my mouse, it's super-contrasting with the calmer hues of the page (and I say this as a person who loves red hehe)
40lorax
Sorry, one more:
When you eliminated the ability to sort by anything other than message recency (making it all-but-impossible to get caught up, if you're in enough groups that you have more than one page worth of topics with unread messages), did you intend to also eliminate the ability to sort "Hot Topics" by hotness? Would you consider at minimum turning that one back on?
When you eliminated the ability to sort by anything other than message recency (making it all-but-impossible to get caught up, if you're in enough groups that you have more than one page worth of topics with unread messages), did you intend to also eliminate the ability to sort "Hot Topics" by hotness? Would you consider at minimum turning that one back on?
42krazy4katz
Just a question:
Why is the header "Group>TopicTopic"?
Why is the header "Group>TopicTopic"?
43lorax
laytonwoman3rd:
That's been the group picture for this group forever. I think you just didn't notice before because it wasn't in that particular location?
That's been the group picture for this group forever. I think you just didn't notice before because it wasn't in that particular location?
44mart1n
A minor point - the header on the main page is in sentence case for all bar "From Your Groups, Your Posts and Your Starred Topics"
45timspalding
For reference, this is new and old.
46conceptDawg
>42 krazy4katz: Because you have two eyes. You need two Topic Topics.
47aspirit
Okay, I can post messages to this thread using my browser's "Desktop view" feature, but I can't get the text box to respond in the mobile view on my mobile device.
The font is physically painful to read. It is really hurting my head.
The excess spacing and large font that can only be minimized by going to the desktop view puts too little text on the screen without scrolling. Going to desktop view makes the font look lighter and blurrier, almost impossible to read through eye strain.
This version of Talk so far sucks more than the previous version on an Android device, in my opinion. This is a radical change for regular mobile users, and not a good one.
The font is physically painful to read. It is really hurting my head.
The excess spacing and large font that can only be minimized by going to the desktop view puts too little text on the screen without scrolling. Going to desktop view makes the font look lighter and blurrier, almost impossible to read through eye strain.
This version of Talk so far sucks more than the previous version on an Android device, in my opinion. This is a radical change for regular mobile users, and not a good one.
48conceptDawg
>44 mart1n: Yep. We're in a transition there. You'll see more of that...then, hopefully, less. heh
49conceptDawg
>47 aspirit: Is this mobile device an Android?
And can you give me more information about said device?
And can you give me more information about said device?
51amanda4242
>45 timspalding: I like the changes to stars and ignore, as well as the color change for topics where all the post have been read.
52mart1n
I'm looking at it on a big PC monitor and an android phone, and generally I think I like it. In terms of layout, on the phone I'd rather there was a bit less white space, so that I could see more than 8 topics, but otherwise it works for me.
54katiekrug
>45 timspalding: - The new looks so much cleaner and more readable, IMO.
55LolaWalser
OK, I am missing something from the old setup, after all--the ability to go to different places if you clicked different bits of information in the thread list (Topic list). Right now, wherever you click on the the haunting RED scrollbar you get taken into the highlighted thread.
Previously, clicking on the Group name took you to the Group topic list and the handle of the latest member to post was also clickable. This was useful for checking out new profiles appearing in topics, if you suspected spam or needed reminders etc.
Previously, clicking on the Group name took you to the Group topic list and the handle of the latest member to post was also clickable. This was useful for checking out new profiles appearing in topics, if you suspected spam or needed reminders etc.
56gabriel
Some design comments: I don't like the way the main talk page looks so much like a giant table. All the boxes! The old design looked more like a list...
A couple things that I think make it more like a table: the stacked author/time in the right-most column, the exterior gridlines, the fact that threads where there aren't any unread posts are highlighted...
There really needs to be a more subtle visual way of distinguishing between the unread/read threads. The difference between the bold and unbolded titles is grating to me - you definitely don't need both bolded titles and highlighting the all-read threads (and visually, it signals in different directions, imho).
I'd create a little more space at the top - it looks cramped. And the "Groups and Posts" header doesn't match the style of the other headers - all the others have "Topics..."; the G&P header just says "From Your Groups, Your Posts...."
I don't have a problem with the font sizes, and I like the new fonts and sidebar layouts.
A couple things that I think make it more like a table: the stacked author/time in the right-most column, the exterior gridlines, the fact that threads where there aren't any unread posts are highlighted...
There really needs to be a more subtle visual way of distinguishing between the unread/read threads. The difference between the bold and unbolded titles is grating to me - you definitely don't need both bolded titles and highlighting the all-read threads (and visually, it signals in different directions, imho).
I'd create a little more space at the top - it looks cramped. And the "Groups and Posts" header doesn't match the style of the other headers - all the others have "Topics..."; the G&P header just says "From Your Groups, Your Posts...."
I don't have a problem with the font sizes, and I like the new fonts and sidebar layouts.
57jjwilson61
>27 katiekrug: Same here. My phone is a Huawei Honor 5x KIW-L24. Android 6.0.1.
58vancouverdeb
I don't like the change. I really preferred that when I'd read a a post, it changed colour, so I knew where I was on any particular thread. That is my biggest complaint. The other is that while the font might be bigger ( I don't notice it really ) , the font seems to be lighter or less readable. The other font seemed bolder on the page. I find this less readable. I'm on my laptop, which is what I usually use while on library thing.
59Darth-Heather
the only thing I can't quite find is the option that used to be on the left under "Your World" - I don't see the selection for Favorites? That's how I keep track of threads I'm currently posting in, like book challenges that I go back to often to update. Is it here someplace and I'm just not seeing it?
60mart1n
>57 jjwilson61: Re posting from an android phone - I can edit a previous post fine, but I can't add a new one - I can't tap in to the "Add a message" textbox. Samsung A90.
61mart1n
>60 mart1n: But it works if I use the "Reply" link. Though I can't reply to my own post, because there isn't that option (Was always the case and I didn't notice?!).
62amanda4242
I'm really not liking the red for scrolling; it's making me feel like I'm in a slasher movie. The yellowish color that's still there when scrolling over the homepage talk module is much more pleasant.
63timspalding
>53 anglemark: When will it be possible to translate the strings? (Why aren't the old ones re-used?)
Sorry. Chris is in the files a lot now, but I will make the changes later.
Previously, clicking on the Group name took you to the Group topic list and the handle of the latest member to post was also clickable. This was useful for checking out new profiles appearing in topics, if you suspected spam or needed reminders etc.
The group name was not a separate link--it was part of the topic. The user name was a link. And there was a separate link for the topic and the last message in the topic. I think the gain is worth it here--as surfaced in that topic about how people use Talk, there was a lot of confusion and people having to click the small words "X unread" to get to where they want to go. Having it be a single link is a sensible design choice, I feel.
I don't like the change. I really preferred that when I'd read a a post, it changed colour, so I knew where I was on any particular thread. That is my biggest complaint. The other is that while the font might be bigger ( I don't notice it really ) , the font seems to be lighter or less readable. The other font seemed bolder on the page. I find this less readable. I'm on my laptop, which is what I usually use while on library thing.
It does change color. On the main Talk page read items are light blue. Unread items are white with bold text. Within the topics, the colors are not appreciably changed. New items are blue.
I don't like the change. I really preferred that when I'd read a a post, it changed colour, so I knew where I was on any particular thread. That is my biggest complaint. The other is that while the font might be bigger ( I don't notice it really ) , the font seems to be lighter or less readable. The other font seemed bolder on the page. I find this less readable. I'm on my laptop, which is what I usually use while on library thing.
I'd be interested in others' opinion of the font.
the only thing I can't quite find is the option that used to be on the left under "Your World" - I don't see the selection for Favorites? That's how I keep track of threads I'm currently posting in, like book challenges that I go back to often to update. Is it here someplace and I'm just not seeing it?
No, clearly it fell off. We'll look at it.
I'm really not liking the red for scrolling; it's making me feel like I'm in a slasher movie. The yellowish color that's still there when scrolling over the homepage talk module is much more pleasant.
It is striking, I agree. I want to hear more opinions, and to see if it grows on people.
Sorry. Chris is in the files a lot now, but I will make the changes later.
Previously, clicking on the Group name took you to the Group topic list and the handle of the latest member to post was also clickable. This was useful for checking out new profiles appearing in topics, if you suspected spam or needed reminders etc.
The group name was not a separate link--it was part of the topic. The user name was a link. And there was a separate link for the topic and the last message in the topic. I think the gain is worth it here--as surfaced in that topic about how people use Talk, there was a lot of confusion and people having to click the small words "X unread" to get to where they want to go. Having it be a single link is a sensible design choice, I feel.
I don't like the change. I really preferred that when I'd read a a post, it changed colour, so I knew where I was on any particular thread. That is my biggest complaint. The other is that while the font might be bigger ( I don't notice it really ) , the font seems to be lighter or less readable. The other font seemed bolder on the page. I find this less readable. I'm on my laptop, which is what I usually use while on library thing.
It does change color. On the main Talk page read items are light blue. Unread items are white with bold text. Within the topics, the colors are not appreciably changed. New items are blue.
I don't like the change. I really preferred that when I'd read a a post, it changed colour, so I knew where I was on any particular thread. That is my biggest complaint. The other is that while the font might be bigger ( I don't notice it really ) , the font seems to be lighter or less readable. The other font seemed bolder on the page. I find this less readable. I'm on my laptop, which is what I usually use while on library thing.
I'd be interested in others' opinion of the font.
the only thing I can't quite find is the option that used to be on the left under "Your World" - I don't see the selection for Favorites? That's how I keep track of threads I'm currently posting in, like book challenges that I go back to often to update. Is it here someplace and I'm just not seeing it?
No, clearly it fell off. We'll look at it.
I'm really not liking the red for scrolling; it's making me feel like I'm in a slasher movie. The yellowish color that's still there when scrolling over the homepage talk module is much more pleasant.
It is striking, I agree. I want to hear more opinions, and to see if it grows on people.
64rosalita
The main header row on the Groups and Posts page looks fine on my iMac but it's wonky on my iPhone SE (original):
There's Group, then GroupTopicTopic, then New/Total, then Last Message. No bueno.
Edited to add: I forgot to say that when I click into a topic, it looks so much cleaner and easier to read than the old site. That part I love!
There's Group, then GroupTopicTopic, then New/Total, then Last Message. No bueno.
Edited to add: I forgot to say that when I click into a topic, it looks so much cleaner and easier to read than the old site. That part I love!
65katiekrug
>63 timspalding: - I don't mind the font, but it does look lighter so I can see how some people might not like it.
The red scrolling bar is rather jarring. Maybe something less drastically different? A more muted red shade perhaps?
The red scrolling bar is rather jarring. Maybe something less drastically different? A more muted red shade perhaps?
66ffortsa
Lots of thoughts, most of which are already mentioned. That light blue is a killer for old eyes. and PLEASE PUT BACK SORT BY TOPIC! It's all I've ever used to keep track of the people I keep track of.
Also, I can't find that arrow you described to get rid of the group/topic divide. And I hate it, because my group's name is long and that spreads out the lines on the screen too much.
I do almost all my LT stuff at my desk, not on my phone. A little on my tablet, but mainly reading, not posting. So far, I'm not happy with the way this looks on my fairly new laptop.
Also, I can't find that arrow you described to get rid of the group/topic divide. And I hate it, because my group's name is long and that spreads out the lines on the screen too much.
I do almost all my LT stuff at my desk, not on my phone. A little on my tablet, but mainly reading, not posting. So far, I'm not happy with the way this looks on my fairly new laptop.
68lorax
timspalding (#45)
So, almost twice as many topics visible in the old one, and you wonder why we're complaining about whitespace?
So, almost twice as many topics visible in the old one, and you wonder why we're complaining about whitespace?
69ffortsa
>68 lorax: Right!
70amanda4242
>66 ffortsa: Also, I can't find that arrow you described to get rid of the group/topic divide.
It's that weird looking arrow to theright left of Topic.
It's that weird looking arrow to the
71thorold
- great to see that Talk works on phones, now (almost), but scrolling through long threads on a small screen is never going to be much fun, however you present it.
- Posting from iPhone isn’t working for me - there is an edit box but it doesn’t bring up a keyboard (iPhoneSE, iOS 13.7)
- the blockquote style looks odd, it’s showing up in a larger font size than body text.
- the difference between the coloured header bars for read and unread posts is difficult to see with my colour vision/screen combination: it would be easier if there were some difference in shade or text style to make it more obvious.
- Posting from iPhone isn’t working for me - there is an edit box but it doesn’t bring up a keyboard (iPhoneSE, iOS 13.7)
- the blockquote style looks odd, it’s showing up in a larger font size than body text.
- the difference between the coloured header bars for read and unread posts is difficult to see with my colour vision/screen combination: it would be easier if there were some difference in shade or text style to make it more obvious.
73Marissa_Doyle
>45 timspalding: There's such a thing as too much aesthetic white space. Just saying.
74thorold
>72 timspalding: No, the read and unread posts on the topic pages. The colours on the main Talk page are fine for me.
75ffortsa
>70 amanda4242: I have no arrow to the left of topictopic
And I've deleted the right column entirely, and can't find a way to get it back. My fault, but I don't want to miss your fun announcements.
And I've deleted the right column entirely, and can't find a way to get it back. My fault, but I don't want to miss your fun announcements.
76Marissa_Doyle
>63 timspalding: Re the font in the topics list: the kerning feels too tight, so that the letters seem to squish together and get "fuzzy" and therefore more difficult to read. I'm on my laptop, btw; I don't use my phone for LT--only if I'm away from home and needing to check for an item in my library. So yes, the topics themselves are less easy to read, while being spaced too far apart.
77amanda4242
>75 ffortsa: Oh, did you mean for the homepage module? It's not there, but it should be for the Talk tab.
78laytonwoman3rd
Another vote against the red. Even if you're just trying to "reclaim" it. It's garish.
79ffortsa
>77 amanda4242: My home page shows my talk topics, as that's what I'm interested in.
Group › TopicTopic
this is what the start of my topic lists looks like. No special arrow. I'll check the talk page.
OK. I found it on the talk page, but I infinitely prefer the topics on my home page. AND SORTED AS I NEED THEM. I can be really behind on someone's thread, and I want to know that when they create a new thread, among other reasons.
Group › TopicTopic
this is what the start of my topic lists looks like. No special arrow. I'll check the talk page.
OK. I found it on the talk page, but I infinitely prefer the topics on my home page. AND SORTED AS I NEED THEM. I can be really behind on someone's thread, and I want to know that when they create a new thread, among other reasons.
80Taphophile13
>78 laytonwoman3rd: Agree. Everything else is so muted that the red is even more intense.
81timspalding
>79 ffortsa:
Your window is small somehow. Either your window is small, your screen is small, you've increased the sizing on the page, or you're using a tablet or mobile phone. With a larger screen, you get the icon to change it.
Your window is small somehow. Either your window is small, your screen is small, you've increased the sizing on the page, or you're using a tablet or mobile phone. With a larger screen, you get the icon to change it.
82ffortsa
>81 timspalding: not on my home page. Only on the talk page.
83amanda4242
Ugh, just realized stars are now red. Red is an okay accent color, but this looks like a blood sacrifice.
84ffortsa
Oh good. My right hand news column is back. Thanks, whoever helped me (even if it just happened by itself!).
BTW, when I looked at the TALK page, the colors were great, easy to read.
BTW, when I looked at the TALK page, the colors were great, easy to read.
85SuziQoregon
Please bring back sort by topic. It’s my default sort to keep multiple threads by a person or topic (DUH!) together.
86kac522
Bring back Sorting by headers!
Bring back gold stars instead of red; gold is good, red means bad, like a teacher's red pen.
Bring back gold stars instead of red; gold is good, red means bad, like a teacher's red pen.
87ffortsa
BTW, other reasons for the sort by topic. If I want to find someone's most recent post, if I can sort by topic, it doesn't have to be the last one posted ANYWHERE. It could even be something I've read already. But I know where that particular friend resides on my talk screen (or my home screen) and can go right there. If I'm having a conversation with someone, I don't have to hunt through the flurry of other messages to find that conversation.
89ffortsa
>85 SuziQoregon: thanks for the support and >86 kac522: Yes, I agree completely.
90Aquila
>70 amanda4242: Oh, thank you, I like that!
91LibraryCin
I posted in the other thread, but as I kept reading through I saw the redirect to here for the Talk pages, so am (mostly) copy/pasting (+ adding/rewording a bit):
I am on a PC.
The font seems quite large. But, again, probably just need to get used to it.
The other thing I noticed right away was the light blue for unread vs the light brown/grey-ish for what's already read just doesn't seem like enough of a contrast for me. But, maybe (again), I just need to get used to it.
I also replied to a comment in that thread about the highlighting also being very faint. I agree. When I highlight something to copy/paste, the highlight is quite faint.
I am on a PC.
The font seems quite large. But, again, probably just need to get used to it.
The other thing I noticed right away was the light blue for unread vs the light brown/grey-ish for what's already read just doesn't seem like enough of a contrast for me. But, maybe (again), I just need to get used to it.
I also replied to a comment in that thread about the highlighting also being very faint. I agree. When I highlight something to copy/paste, the highlight is quite faint.
92SuziQoregon
>88 timspalding: Thank you!
94thorold
>71 thorold: posting from iPhone seems to be working now!
I just noticed there’s no “reply” link on my own posts: I suppose that’s logical (was it always like that?) but it would actually be useful when you want to update or clarify something you posted earlier.
I just noticed there’s no “reply” link on my own posts: I suppose that’s logical (was it always like that?) but it would actually be useful when you want to update or clarify something you posted earlier.
95rosalita
>94 thorold: It's a workaround, but you could still use the box at the bottom of the page and manually insert the post reference at the beginning.
96NinieB
1. When I select an unread topic on the *Topics from your groups* page, I am not taken to the first unread message in the thread, but the last read message. The first unread message is way down at the bottom of the screen.
2. To my taste the color contrast between the pale read message bar, and the pale unread message bar, is insufficient. Also, you're conveying information (read versus unread) solely through color, which I don't think is accessible.
3. I'm fine with the red scroll thing on *Topics from your groups*.
4. I agree with others that the copy highlight is distractingly pale.
5. The font doesn't seem big at all to me.
6. I was really hoping we would get a rich text bar to make posting easier.
2. To my taste the color contrast between the pale read message bar, and the pale unread message bar, is insufficient. Also, you're conveying information (read versus unread) solely through color, which I don't think is accessible.
3. I'm fine with the red scroll thing on *Topics from your groups*.
4. I agree with others that the copy highlight is distractingly pale.
5. The font doesn't seem big at all to me.
6. I was really hoping we would get a rich text bar to make posting easier.
97NinieB
One more thing . . . it's now really hard to see my own posts. The little red endcap does not stand out.
98conceptDawg
>96 NinieB:
1. That would be a bug. I'll look into it.
2. You are correct. I'll think about a more accessible way to show that information too.
3. Noted.
6. A rich text bar, or WYSIWYG, is in the plans (with image posting). Things are just happening in stages.
The red endcap doesn't stand out more than the previous brown end cap? I'd have thought it was the opposite.
1. That would be a bug. I'll look into it.
2. You are correct. I'll think about a more accessible way to show that information too.
3. Noted.
6. A rich text bar, or WYSIWYG, is in the plans (with image posting). Things are just happening in stages.
The red endcap doesn't stand out more than the previous brown end cap? I'd have thought it was the opposite.
992wonderY
Test.
Did you just eliminate the Cancel button?
Sad that last person posting is gone. There are some posters that waste my time. More so now, I suppose.
Did you just eliminate the Cancel button?
Sad that last person posting is gone. There are some posters that waste my time. More so now, I suppose.
100timspalding
4. I agree with others that the copy highlight is distractingly pale.
I didn't see what you meant until I used Chrome. It's normal on Safari. I agree strongly it needs to have more contrast.
I didn't see what you meant until I used Chrome. It's normal on Safari. I agree strongly it needs to have more contrast.
101avatiakh
>74 thorold: I agree. On my laptop it is really hard to discern between 'read' and 'unread' messages on threads yet when I checked on my phone (which I never use for LT) the contrast is much stronger, the 'read' messages are a different colour.
102amanda4242
Would it be possible to have an option to close the menu on the left, like we can with work page modules? I'm finding it very distracting.
103davidgn
First thought: damn, this is awful.
Two weeks from now: OK, this is probably actually better.
Two weeks from now: OK, this is probably actually better.
104NinieB
>98 conceptDawg: On the red endcap, it seems like the contrast is lower than the old dark brown. Maybe my red is a bit less loud than others' red?
>100 timspalding: I'm using Firefox, so pale highlight in both Chrome and Firefox
>100 timspalding: I'm using Firefox, so pale highlight in both Chrome and Firefox
105JacobHolt
>47 aspirit: I'm having the same reaction as you--too little text on each screen, too much white space, and the font is not as visible/readable as it was before.
106JacobHolt
>50 lilithcat: Agreed. The lack of information density on the "Talk" page will take some getting used to, and may end up just being a minor annoyance. But I hope this isn't what the "Your books" page will end up looking like--that would be a serious usability issue for me.
1072wonderY
I see there are vast differences from laptop to iphone. Much less functionality on the phone now. I will probably be much less active from now on.
108kac522
>88 timspalding: Yay! Many thanks. I always sort the Talk lists by "Unread" (or now I suppose it's "New"), and that way all the threads with Unread messages I've starred come to the top of the page.
Overall, I do like the new design, cleaner font and on my desktop I personally like more white space--makes it easier to read. I use Chrome and yes, the blue and tan highlights for read/unread messages need more definition, as well as highlighting text. Give 'em some muscle.
Red or brown endcaps for my own messages are both good; both stand out.
Overall, I do like the new design, cleaner font and on my desktop I personally like more white space--makes it easier to read. I use Chrome and yes, the blue and tan highlights for read/unread messages need more definition, as well as highlighting text. Give 'em some muscle.
Red or brown endcaps for my own messages are both good; both stand out.
109Petroglyph
I like the new look for talk. While the people complaining about there being more topics per screen in the old layout are objectively correct in stating that fact, I also think that that is not necessarily a good thing. It always felt like overkill to me. I'm happy with there being more space around the table rows -- makes it feel more like an inbox with email threads. It feels like some thought has gone into the design other than "sort the topics in a list and dump it on a screen".
I also like the scrolling/highlighting bar.
My only complaints (so far) are about the colours:
I also like the scrolling/highlighting bar.
My only complaints (so far) are about the colours:
- The colour distinction between 'read' and 'unread' in topic pages is too slight: a pale blue-gray and a pale blue are not distinctive enough.
- The red scrolling/highlighting bar is the wrong colour; red means that something is wrong.
110Crypto-Willobie
I'm usually one of the Luddite curmudgeons, but I like it. (And I'm getting used to the new FB presentation -- I don't really like its LOOk but I like the improved functionality.
111timspalding
The colour distinction between 'read' and 'unread' in topic pages is too slight: a pale blue-gray and a pale blue are not distinctive enough
I'd be okay with a change here. Also, the meaning is reversed now from the Talk page--blue means read on Talk, unread on topic.
The red scrolling/highlighting bar is the wrong colour; red means that something is wrong.
Enough people have said this, I think we should move to yellow. It's too jarring.
I'd be okay with a change here. Also, the meaning is reversed now from the Talk page--blue means read on Talk, unread on topic.
The red scrolling/highlighting bar is the wrong colour; red means that something is wrong.
Enough people have said this, I think we should move to yellow. It's too jarring.
112FAMeulstee
I will get used to this, maybe I am even going to like it.
One remark, in the right column of my thread the checkmarks don't show for books in the collection "to read" and "reading. The grey checkmark does show on the series pages.
(using Chrome/Windows 10)
One remark, in the right column of my thread the checkmarks don't show for books in the collection "to read" and "reading. The grey checkmark does show on the series pages.
(using Chrome/Windows 10)
113gabriel
The new Talk interface is visually brash and unattractive. There is simply too much going on, and there's nothing soft or welcoming in the design.
* While the talk threads themselves have rounded corners and muted colours, the main Talk page has pointed corners, a tonne of intersections, and a very strong red background as you scroll over different threads. The page looks like a whole series of boxes - and because they are a combination of all-read and partly-read threads, it's a bunch of different-sized boxes. It would be great to reduce the contrast between the all-read and partly-read threads, soften the corners, and make the highlighting less brash.
* There's too much going on: Bold in two places for unread threads, blue for read threads, red for scrolling. Simplifying the visual signals would make for a more attractive and readable interface.
* There's too much white space. There tends to be a lot of room between the thread title and the new/old thread numbers; and there's too much room between rows. It seems like the gap between rows is in part necessitated by stacking the author/date information on the right. It would be better to unstack that information, and allow the entries to take up less vertical space. You could push the new/old column a little to the left to make room for the unstacked author/date, which would help reduce white space as well.
* While the talk threads themselves have rounded corners and muted colours, the main Talk page has pointed corners, a tonne of intersections, and a very strong red background as you scroll over different threads. The page looks like a whole series of boxes - and because they are a combination of all-read and partly-read threads, it's a bunch of different-sized boxes. It would be great to reduce the contrast between the all-read and partly-read threads, soften the corners, and make the highlighting less brash.
* There's too much going on: Bold in two places for unread threads, blue for read threads, red for scrolling. Simplifying the visual signals would make for a more attractive and readable interface.
* There's too much white space. There tends to be a lot of room between the thread title and the new/old thread numbers; and there's too much room between rows. It seems like the gap between rows is in part necessitated by stacking the author/date information on the right. It would be better to unstack that information, and allow the entries to take up less vertical space. You could push the new/old column a little to the left to make room for the unstacked author/date, which would help reduce white space as well.
114timspalding
There is a "Desktop view" feature in hiding. It was supposed to debut with it, but something went wrong. It will be out soon enough. At that point, if you want the desktop view on your iPhone or whatever, you will be able to get it.
115SandyAMcPherson
Is this a bug in the new talk pages: spoiler tags seem broken and don't hide the comments between the I want to hide this .
Note that a message, (click to see) appears, but the "I want to hide this" is still visible.
Note that a message, (click to see) appears, but the "I want to hide this" is still visible.
116norabelle414
Thoughts when viewing on a computer:
Main talk page -
- I really don't like how much white space there is between items. I can see way fewer threads at a time. I tried to zoom out but then I can't read the last message timestamp and user. Those are important information and they should be the same size as the topic name and number of messages.
- I like the "start new topic" button. Looks nice.
- I think the topics with no new messages could be more gray and less blue. They look like they're being highlighted instead of faded out. (Though I'd also be fine if there was no color change for those items, I think the difference between the bold text and non-bold is stark enough.)
- I like the collapsing "group" column. Very fancy!
Topic pages -
- I don't mind the font size at 100% zoom, but the sidebars take up so much space. There seems to be a lot of extra space in the left side bar in particular...couldn't it be made narrower? It's not like the text there ever changes.
- The color of unread messages within a topic seems to be the same color as topics that DON"T have an unread message on the main talk page. Isn't that counter-intuitive? The same color should not indicate opposite things on different pages.
- I really like having the number of participants at the top
- Star and ignore buttons are nice but I worry about how close together they are.
- Agree with everyone else that I can barely see highlighted text. If there's any time to use the stark red color, it's highlighted text!
- I do like the red for the stars
- Since you asked, I think the font is too...delicate? Slight? I'm not sure what the right word is. It's hard to read.
ETA: a couple other things
- I really like the look of all the buttons (e.g. "Save message" "Preview" "Cancel")
- The red bar indicating my posts looks great with the taupe color of read posts but very weird with the light blue color of unread posts....so I'll just refresh the page after I post anything ;-)
Main talk page -
- I really don't like how much white space there is between items. I can see way fewer threads at a time. I tried to zoom out but then I can't read the last message timestamp and user. Those are important information and they should be the same size as the topic name and number of messages.
- I like the "start new topic" button. Looks nice.
- I think the topics with no new messages could be more gray and less blue. They look like they're being highlighted instead of faded out. (Though I'd also be fine if there was no color change for those items, I think the difference between the bold text and non-bold is stark enough.)
- I like the collapsing "group" column. Very fancy!
Topic pages -
- I don't mind the font size at 100% zoom, but the sidebars take up so much space. There seems to be a lot of extra space in the left side bar in particular...couldn't it be made narrower? It's not like the text there ever changes.
- The color of unread messages within a topic seems to be the same color as topics that DON"T have an unread message on the main talk page. Isn't that counter-intuitive? The same color should not indicate opposite things on different pages.
- I really like having the number of participants at the top
- Star and ignore buttons are nice but I worry about how close together they are.
- Agree with everyone else that I can barely see highlighted text. If there's any time to use the stark red color, it's highlighted text!
- I do like the red for the stars
- Since you asked, I think the font is too...delicate? Slight? I'm not sure what the right word is. It's hard to read.
ETA: a couple other things
- I really like the look of all the buttons (e.g. "Save message" "Preview" "Cancel")
- The red bar indicating my posts looks great with the taupe color of read posts but very weird with the light blue color of unread posts....so I'll just refresh the page after I post anything ;-)
117lilithcat
>115 SandyAMcPherson:
There seems to be a problem with certain tags (italics, for instance) in some browsers, like Firefox.
There seems to be a problem with certain tags (italics, for instance) in some browsers, like Firefox.
118SandyAMcPherson
>117 lilithcat: I'm using Safari (on a Mac Notebook) and the spoiler tags are the only ones not apparently working.
The coding for italics seems to work.
The coding for italics seems to work.
119lilithcat
Well, that's random!
On Firefox, "preview" isn't working, either.
But I see they fixed the "highlight" contrast.
On Firefox, "preview" isn't working, either.
But I see they fixed the "highlight" contrast.
120ulmannc
>45 timspalding: Someone may have commented on this but I don't have the time to read all the lines.
I prefer the old format as I don't like all the blank space and the old font was just fine for me.
I'm also having trouble with the background color on the line with the message number. I find it difficult to distinguish between what I have read and what I haven't read.
I'm running Windows 10 Professional on a 19 inch Dell flat panel. I'm running on the latest version of Chrome.
I prefer the old format as I don't like all the blank space and the old font was just fine for me.
I'm also having trouble with the background color on the line with the message number. I find it difficult to distinguish between what I have read and what I haven't read.
I'm running Windows 10 Professional on a 19 inch Dell flat panel. I'm running on the latest version of Chrome.
121norabelle414
Thoughts when viewing on a smartphone:
Main talk page
- When in portrait mode, the last message timestamp and username are no longer shown at all, which sucks, but they show up when I turn to landscape mode so it's fine.
- In fact, I would say that mobile-landscape-mode on my phone is probably my favorite view for this page. Much less whitespace than the other views, and the last message timestamp and username are not too much smaller than the rest of the text.
Topic pages
- Same here, I think mobile-landscape-mode is clearly the ideal viewing for the website, which I find displeasing. When I look at the website on a computer, which is 99.9% of my viewing, it says to me "you should be looking at this on a phone"
Main talk page
- When in portrait mode, the last message timestamp and username are no longer shown at all, which sucks, but they show up when I turn to landscape mode so it's fine.
- In fact, I would say that mobile-landscape-mode on my phone is probably my favorite view for this page. Much less whitespace than the other views, and the last message timestamp and username are not too much smaller than the rest of the text.
Topic pages
- Same here, I think mobile-landscape-mode is clearly the ideal viewing for the website, which I find displeasing. When I look at the website on a computer, which is 99.9% of my viewing, it says to me "you should be looking at this on a phone"
122norabelle414
The sidebars on topic pages:
On a computer, when a topic has no touchstones, the sidebars stay where they are. This is fine.
On a computer, when a topic has enough touchstones that they go past the end of the right sidebar, the right sidebar scrolls, and keeps scrolling past the touchstones to the bottom of the page. Is there a way to get it to stop scrolling once it gets to the bottom of the touchstones? Or make it scroll on all pages if you have to, but it's weird to see it scroll on one topic and not on another.
On a phone, in landscape mode, the right sidebar has moved to the bottom, which has been discussed elsewhere. The left sidebar scrolls forever. Is there a way to get it to stop scrolling when it gets to the bottom of the list? Mobile-view arguably needs the sidebar more than computer-view does.
Maybe the information from the right sidebar could move over to the bottom of the left sidebar, instead of to the bottom of the page?
On a computer, when a topic has no touchstones, the sidebars stay where they are. This is fine.
On a computer, when a topic has enough touchstones that they go past the end of the right sidebar, the right sidebar scrolls, and keeps scrolling past the touchstones to the bottom of the page. Is there a way to get it to stop scrolling once it gets to the bottom of the touchstones? Or make it scroll on all pages if you have to, but it's weird to see it scroll on one topic and not on another.
On a phone, in landscape mode, the right sidebar has moved to the bottom, which has been discussed elsewhere. The left sidebar scrolls forever. Is there a way to get it to stop scrolling when it gets to the bottom of the list? Mobile-view arguably needs the sidebar more than computer-view does.
Maybe the information from the right sidebar could move over to the bottom of the left sidebar, instead of to the bottom of the page?
123amanda4242
I just got a chance to look at this on my desktop, and the font is really hard to read on the larger screen. The bold stuff looks okay, but everything else lacks...weight, I guess? especially the serif font.
124jjwilson61
>121 norabelle414: I don't get the timestamp and username in landscape on my phone. I guess the screen is too small.
125vancouverdeb
It looks much better on my mobile than on my desktop computer. And I use my desktop for LT about 99 % of the time.
126YouKneeK
The Good and Indifferent
In general, I like the way it looks. I really enjoy not having to zoom in and out on mobile; that’s a big improvement. I think it looks good on my desktop too, which is where I spend the majority of my LT time. I personally don’t have any issues with the font or the colors, not even the red highlighting. I kind of like the way the red stands out as a placeholder, but imagine I’ll be find with the proposed change to yellow. I'm rarely much bothered by colors one way or the other.
The Big Stuff (for me)
The spoiler tag issue already reported by >115 SandyAMcPherson: is a big, BIG one for me – I hate spoilers, I was horrified to see all the ugly, nasty, naked spoilers in my reading journal thread, and I'm scared to read any other threads now. Please fix yesterday. :)
The preview button not working is a problem, but I believe I saw a post indicating you’re already aware and working on it.
I can’t see the star in the mobile view (Android) on the Talk page. I only see the Group/Topic and the New/Total post counts. I use the stars for a variety of reasons, but one big use they have is to remind me to pay extra attention to those threads when I see new posts in them. I miss that visual indicator on the topic list.
The Minor Stuff
I’ll get used to it, but I wouldn’t mind less white space either. Maybe half as much as there is. In e-mail apps, I always go for the most compact view available. The more words visible on a single page, the faster I can process them.
This isn't something changed from the old version but, to spin off of what >122 norabelle414: said, I think it would be great if the right sidebar could scroll separately from the messages on the desktop view. This is particularly relevant for reading journal threads where there may be a lot of touchstone links that mostly represent the books the thread owner read and discussed. I might be way down in the thread and get the urge to scroll through that list, but I have to jump to the top of the page and then lose my place in the thread. Ideally, the sidebar should remain scrolled to the top even after I’ve scrolled down through the thread, then I could separately scroll through that sidebar if I need to.
In general, I like the way it looks. I really enjoy not having to zoom in and out on mobile; that’s a big improvement. I think it looks good on my desktop too, which is where I spend the majority of my LT time. I personally don’t have any issues with the font or the colors, not even the red highlighting. I kind of like the way the red stands out as a placeholder, but imagine I’ll be find with the proposed change to yellow. I'm rarely much bothered by colors one way or the other.
The Big Stuff (for me)
The spoiler tag issue already reported by >115 SandyAMcPherson: is a big, BIG one for me – I hate spoilers, I was horrified to see all the ugly, nasty, naked spoilers in my reading journal thread, and I'm scared to read any other threads now. Please fix yesterday. :)
The preview button not working is a problem, but I believe I saw a post indicating you’re already aware and working on it.
I can’t see the star in the mobile view (Android) on the Talk page. I only see the Group/Topic and the New/Total post counts. I use the stars for a variety of reasons, but one big use they have is to remind me to pay extra attention to those threads when I see new posts in them. I miss that visual indicator on the topic list.
The Minor Stuff
I’ll get used to it, but I wouldn’t mind less white space either. Maybe half as much as there is. In e-mail apps, I always go for the most compact view available. The more words visible on a single page, the faster I can process them.
This isn't something changed from the old version but, to spin off of what >122 norabelle414: said, I think it would be great if the right sidebar could scroll separately from the messages on the desktop view. This is particularly relevant for reading journal threads where there may be a lot of touchstone links that mostly represent the books the thread owner read and discussed. I might be way down in the thread and get the urge to scroll through that list, but I have to jump to the top of the page and then lose my place in the thread. Ideally, the sidebar should remain scrolled to the top even after I’ve scrolled down through the thread, then I could separately scroll through that sidebar if I need to.
127SandyAMcPherson
>126 YouKneeK: I agree strongly with you on this spoilers issue.
It is a *big stuff* issue.
I visit Green Dragon pages quite a bit, especially the fantasy and mystery readers' threads, plus many of the 75-reading-challenge people. Spoilers are a real downer and LT members are generally very respectful in that regard. So I certainly am on the same page as YouKneeK.
As of today, I'm leery about posting even slightly-remotely any spoiler comments. Which is boring, because I like to illustrate my evaluation with commentary that might ruin the story for a new reader. It's part of the fun participating in book discussions, no?
I switched to using Safari about a year ago because FireFox was not promptly onto correcting display issues (some problems have lingered for more than 12 month now).
I use Google Photos, Flickr and a couple more obscure websites which haven't worked since a F-Fox update over a year ago. These same websites are just fine on Safari and Chrome (from my perspective).
Just saying, in case the developers at LT want some insights about what seems broken.
Edited to add support to the idea of the Right-hand side bar scrolling separately from the messages on Talk when viewing on a desktop or lap top device...
It is a *big stuff* issue.
I visit Green Dragon pages quite a bit, especially the fantasy and mystery readers' threads, plus many of the 75-reading-challenge people. Spoilers are a real downer and LT members are generally very respectful in that regard. So I certainly am on the same page as YouKneeK.
As of today, I'm leery about posting even slightly-remotely any spoiler comments. Which is boring, because I like to illustrate my evaluation with commentary that might ruin the story for a new reader. It's part of the fun participating in book discussions, no?
I switched to using Safari about a year ago because FireFox was not promptly onto correcting display issues (some problems have lingered for more than 12 month now).
I use Google Photos, Flickr and a couple more obscure websites which haven't worked since a F-Fox update over a year ago. These same websites are just fine on Safari and Chrome (from my perspective).
Just saying, in case the developers at LT want some insights about what seems broken.
Edited to add support to the idea of the Right-hand side bar scrolling separately from the messages on Talk when viewing on a desktop or lap top device...
128quondame
>1 timspalding: I use sorting that isn't your default. I like Total. I'm sorry others get confused, but I avoid certain threads and I very much liked having them remain floating at the top with the other unread threads than having to sort through the ungainly mess of white/pale blue that you've decided on.
Also, if you have an entry for Preview, it should work!
Also, if you have an entry for Preview, it should work!
129krazy4katz
>46 conceptDawg: Hah! I guess that was so obvious I should have known!
130quondame
>99 2wonderY: Different reason(s), but I found last person posting useful as well. And it was so cute to see the little tombstones.
131quondame
>102 amanda4242: It is rather large. I like it there, but a couple of font sizes smaller.
133reconditereader
O gods, I *HATE* the red hover-highlight.
I also hate how there's now so much less info on one screen before you have to scroll, but I guess I'll live. There's way too much white space for me.
ETA: Also, when within a topic (as now!), the outside columns are stupidly wide, which exacerbates the too-little-info-on-one-screen problem. I am on a 13" Windows laptop running updated Firefox and this is the only machine on which I access LT. Left column is also stupidly too wide on the main listing of talk topics.
I also hate how there's now so much less info on one screen before you have to scroll, but I guess I'll live. There's way too much white space for me.
ETA: Also, when within a topic (as now!), the outside columns are stupidly wide, which exacerbates the too-little-info-on-one-screen problem. I am on a 13" Windows laptop running updated Firefox and this is the only machine on which I access LT. Left column is also stupidly too wide on the main listing of talk topics.
134Aquila
I have to agree, the red makes me nervous, though I presume that association would decrease with time.
136reconditereader
Also, did the font get... thinner, somehow? Or am I hallucinating? The main text in people's talk posts seems to be made of thinner lines?
I hate it but I can't tell if it's real or just an artifact of my brain!
I hate it but I can't tell if it's real or just an artifact of my brain!
137amanda4242
>131 quondame: I don't mind its existence, but it's not something that I need to constantly see as I'm reading messages. Being able to collapse it would be really nice.
138AndreasJ
The main Talk page looks unpleasantly busy with the structural elements more pronounced (more like a table than a list as someone put it above). It manages to look more overwhelming than the old one while actually containing less information.
It also looks more old-fashioned, sort of my Hotmail inbox fifteen years ago, which isn't a problem as such, but I'm not sure "vintage" was the look you were going for.
I dislike the red for starred topics. It unpleasantly reminds me of the red "to do" flags in Outlook at work. Please use a colour that suggests something interesting, not something that needs to be fixed.
Was the highlight colour fixed? Either way, I think it's fine now (Firefox 82.0.2 on Windows).
I found the arrow for hiding the Groups coloumn confusing, but don't have a better suggestion. An X might suggest ignoring the group or topic.
It also looks more old-fashioned, sort of my Hotmail inbox fifteen years ago, which isn't a problem as such, but I'm not sure "vintage" was the look you were going for.
I dislike the red for starred topics. It unpleasantly reminds me of the red "to do" flags in Outlook at work. Please use a colour that suggests something interesting, not something that needs to be fixed.
Was the highlight colour fixed? Either way, I think it's fine now (Firefox 82.0.2 on Windows).
I found the arrow for hiding the Groups coloumn confusing, but don't have a better suggestion. An X might suggest ignoring the group or topic.
139AndreasJ
Did the spacing between paragraphs in a post increase? Posts look a little sparse, somehow.
140AndreasJ
On the Talk page, it's counterintuitive that when you click on a group name before a topic title you're taken to the topic rather than the group.
141SandyAMcPherson
>1 timspalding: A few months ago, there was a useful change made in the links with the Reply notations ~
When you chose Mark as read to here, the phrase turned to Marked.
This was very handy to remind me that I had indeed marked the post.
A minor change, but can you or >10 conceptDawg: kindly return that feature?
And on Safari (Mac OS), that yellow highlighter colour for selecting text is still too pale if one makes only a small selection.
When you chose Mark as read to here, the phrase turned to Marked.
This was very handy to remind me that I had indeed marked the post.
A minor change, but can you or >10 conceptDawg: kindly return that feature?
And on Safari (Mac OS), that yellow highlighter colour for selecting text is still too pale if one makes only a small selection.
142leahbird
I could literally weep with joy. Posting from my phone is finally something not horrible! Thank you a billion!
143thorold
After taking a bit more to play around on iPad as well as on Safari on a big screen, I'm starting to get used to it...
I've been using the old format for over a decade so I had trained myself to spot the topics I wanted to look at quite efficiently, but I'm sure the new topic list will be easier to use, even though the information density has gone down. I see what >138 AndreasJ: means about "vintage Hotmail", but a retro-look is quite fitting for LT, no problem with that. I'm finding that I work through the list of unread threads pretty quickly with the new format.
It also feels faster than usual loading long topic threads, especially on the iPad, but maybe that's just because it's morning here and the US is in bed. I notice it still has trouble positioning you accurately at the first unread post if there are images in upstream posts, but that's probably inevitable.
- I find it a bit confusing that the topic list doesn't scroll back to the top when you change between different list modes (say from "Groups and Posts" to "Starred topics").
- "Ignored topics" and "Groups you admin" (since when is "admin" a verb?) are fairly esoteric view modes for most users, they could probably move to the bottom of the list.
- The way the right column within talk topics sometimes sticks and sometimes scrolls with the centre column (presumably when there's more than one screenful of touchstones?) is disconcerting, but I'm sure we'll get used to it.
I've been using the old format for over a decade so I had trained myself to spot the topics I wanted to look at quite efficiently, but I'm sure the new topic list will be easier to use, even though the information density has gone down. I see what >138 AndreasJ: means about "vintage Hotmail", but a retro-look is quite fitting for LT, no problem with that. I'm finding that I work through the list of unread threads pretty quickly with the new format.
It also feels faster than usual loading long topic threads, especially on the iPad, but maybe that's just because it's morning here and the US is in bed. I notice it still has trouble positioning you accurately at the first unread post if there are images in upstream posts, but that's probably inevitable.
- I find it a bit confusing that the topic list doesn't scroll back to the top when you change between different list modes (say from "Groups and Posts" to "Starred topics").
- "Ignored topics" and "Groups you admin" (since when is "admin" a verb?) are fairly esoteric view modes for most users, they could probably move to the bottom of the list.
- The way the right column within talk topics sometimes sticks and sometimes scrolls with the centre column (presumably when there's more than one screenful of touchstones?) is disconcerting, but I'm sure we'll get used to it.
144thorold
>140 AndreasJ: it's counterintuitive that when you click on a group name before a topic title you're taken to the topic
Yes, I felt that as well.
Yes, I felt that as well.
145humouress
I’ve just opened LibraryThing and am still exploring the changes. I’m on Safari on an iPad 1 (at the moment); I’m assuming this is still a work in progress since I’ve lost my stars and I can see ‘Groups’ in a column by itself as well as repeated in the ‘Topics’ column (seems to be sorted out now)?
ETA: Ah, I see that my post is now marked with a redder colour that stands out better. I like that.
ETA 3: Ooh, now my stars are back and the posts I’ve looked at are highlighted in blue rather than white. You are making changes quickly - I’ll leave you to it now.
ETA: Ah, I see that my post is now marked with a redder colour that stands out better. I like that.
ETA 3: Ooh, now my stars are back and the posts I’ve looked at are highlighted in blue rather than white. You are making changes quickly - I’ll leave you to it now.
146mart1n
Not sure if this is a bug or an RSI.
On my (android) phone:
Say I'm viewing by "Your groups".
I click the top bar to open the menu that's in the left sidebar in the full page.
I select "Your posts"
Nothing appears to happen (though it has).
This is because I'm still viewing the "left sidebar" menu - I have to scroll down to see the posts.
I think it would be better if this menu were automatically hidden (as it is if I refresh the page).
On my (android) phone:
Say I'm viewing by "Your groups".
I click the top bar to open the menu that's in the left sidebar in the full page.
I select "Your posts"
Nothing appears to happen (though it has).
This is because I'm still viewing the "left sidebar" menu - I have to scroll down to see the posts.
I think it would be better if this menu were automatically hidden (as it is if I refresh the page).
147AndreasJ
Now checked on the phone too. The main Talk page looks less busy than on the big screen, but OTOH it's harder to see which threads have new posts. Bold the titles?
148mart1n
>147 AndreasJ: They are bold for me (Samsung A90). What phone/OS are you using?
154calm
First impressions -
Everything looks washed out, maybe the text needs to be a touch darker. Also it feels like there is too much white space on my laptop, which is hard on my eyes, but I will probably get used to it.
That red is really distracting.
I miss being able to sort by unread messages.
Having the group info in the right hand column stick (unless there are touchstones) is really distracting. I want to read the thread, not see something else to the side.
Thank you for that collapse arrow. The talk page looks much better to me after using it.
Everything looks washed out, maybe the text needs to be a touch darker. Also it feels like there is too much white space on my laptop, which is hard on my eyes, but I will probably get used to it.
That red is really distracting.
I miss being able to sort by unread messages.
Having the group info in the right hand column stick (unless there are touchstones) is really distracting. I want to read the thread, not see something else to the side.
Thank you for that collapse arrow. The talk page looks much better to me after using it.
155PawsforThought
I've liked most of the changes made (I still have issues with a couple of things in Series but those seem to have been ignored) but the one issue I have with new talk in the change in colour on the read and unread messages in a thread.
As I recall, the old version had a lighter shade on read messages and a darker one for unread, but the new version has a beige for read (with the first message in any thread being read, apparently? even if it's a new-to-me thread) and blue for unread. Makes no sense to me as the darkness is too similar, plus the blue is similar in tone to the one generally used for previously clicked links so using it for something *unread* seems like a very weird choice to me.
As I recall, the old version had a lighter shade on read messages and a darker one for unread, but the new version has a beige for read (with the first message in any thread being read, apparently? even if it's a new-to-me thread) and blue for unread. Makes no sense to me as the darkness is too similar, plus the blue is similar in tone to the one generally used for previously clicked links so using it for something *unread* seems like a very weird choice to me.
156AndreasJ
>147 AndreasJ:, >148 mart1n:, >149 AndreasJ:
Now I see the bold on the phone too, without having changed anything, AFAIK. I also see a lot more whitespace, which seems a step in the wrong direction.
Now I see the bold on the phone too, without having changed anything, AFAIK. I also see a lot more whitespace, which seems a step in the wrong direction.
157bernsad
This is dreadful! The font is too fine and there is too much white space, it seems to lack substance.
158ScarletBea
I love the font myself, though - just the space is not even between the different columns.
I'm now looking at it on my tablet and the font shows like before, isn't this strange?
Still don't like the jarring red, though.
I'm now looking at it on my tablet and the font shows like before, isn't this strange?
Still don't like the jarring red, though.
159casvelyn
On the whole I like it. I'll need to get used to it, sure, but I like it.
Just a couple things: The red bar on the Talk page that shows you where your cursor is INTENSE when you're moving your mouse. It's like a red strobe light. The color itself is nice and fits the aesthetic, it just could be a little less bright.
For the font used in individual posts, it's either a bit thin or not dark enough, but that could be my monitor settings. It's not too small though, so that's not it.
Just a couple things: The red bar on the Talk page that shows you where your cursor is INTENSE when you're moving your mouse. It's like a red strobe light. The color itself is nice and fits the aesthetic, it just could be a little less bright.
For the font used in individual posts, it's either a bit thin or not dark enough, but that could be my monitor settings. It's not too small though, so that's not it.
160jessibud2
When looking at the threads, I am finding it almost impossible to see a difference in colour between read and unread posts. I do sort by *jump to first unread*, and I suppose I can always tell by looking at the time and date posted but the colour itself is barely distinguishable. I am on my laptop. I never come to LT on my phone so those issues for phone are not applicable to me.
161Crypto-Willobie
Big dummy me... now I get why I don't have many of the complaints made in this thread. It's that I never use the actual Talk tab/page -- I access Talk exclusively through a module I have on my Home Page. There I use only the columns Hot Topics, Your Groups, and Your Posts which are sorted into Group / Topic / Unread / Last Message. And many of the new changes do not affect this set up -- no red scroll bars and I forget what else.
Actually the new red, where I see it, looks more cranberry or burgundy rather than gory. On the actual posts, I rather like the deployment of white space as it makes the contrast better for these old eyes. I agree with the comment that the typeface could be a tad darker, but I can live with it as is.
A couple weirdnesses:
- The preview button does not seem to be working right now.
- When I highlight a word or phrase to copy or delete in Cut-n-Paste, the highlight is so pale I almost can't tell it's there at all.
Actually the new red, where I see it, looks more cranberry or burgundy rather than gory. On the actual posts, I rather like the deployment of white space as it makes the contrast better for these old eyes. I agree with the comment that the typeface could be a tad darker, but I can live with it as is.
A couple weirdnesses:
- The preview button does not seem to be working right now.
- When I highlight a word or phrase to copy or delete in Cut-n-Paste, the highlight is so pale I almost can't tell it's there at all.
162karenmarie
I'm glad to see that sorting on Talk headers is coming back.
I'd prefer one line per entry like it was before - like others have mentioned I can only see half of the topics.
Glad to hear that the red may go away when hovering over a topic. It is jarring.
I never use my phone for anything but looking up items in my catalog. I guess I'm a dinosaur for using a laptop and a 23" monitor.
I'd prefer one line per entry like it was before - like others have mentioned I can only see half of the topics.
Glad to hear that the red may go away when hovering over a topic. It is jarring.
I never use my phone for anything but looking up items in my catalog. I guess I'm a dinosaur for using a laptop and a 23" monitor.
163John5918
>161 Crypto-Willobie: When I highlight a word or phrase to copy or delete in Cut-n-Paste, the highlight is so pale I almost can't tell it's there at all.
Me too.
Me too.
164lorax
karenmarie (#162):
I guess I'm a dinosaur for using a laptop and a 23" monitor.
🦖 Solidarity!
(The quote was supposed to be italicized, if like me you can't see italics at the moment.)
I guess I'm a dinosaur for using a laptop and a 23" monitor.
🦖 Solidarity!
(The quote was supposed to be italicized, if like me you can't see italics at the moment.)
165SandyAMcPherson
>163 John5918: Ditto
At the bottom of >141 SandyAMcPherson:
I think browser choice may affect this feature... anyone else?
I'm on a Mac laptop, using Safari. FireFox had too many not-working features.
Edited to say: the Devs must be working their assess off.
Already they've altered the main Talk view (of the Group you follow) so that the highlighting is better (and no red) and the blue-highlighted "Read" threads are changed to unbolded text on white. I like that tweak a lot. Thanks!
At the bottom of >141 SandyAMcPherson:
I think browser choice may affect this feature... anyone else?
I'm on a Mac laptop, using Safari. FireFox had too many not-working features.
Edited to say: the Devs must be working their assess off.
Already they've altered the main Talk view (of the Group you follow) so that the highlighting is better (and no red) and the blue-highlighted "Read" threads are changed to unbolded text on white. I like that tweak a lot. Thanks!
166katiekrug
>164 lorax: - I can see your italics :)
167Collectorator
Medlemmem har stängts av.
169karenmarie
Red gone and single line for Last Message username/day-time. Thank you.
171PawsforThought
>170 lilithcat: Completely gone for me too, and I'm on Chrome.
172karenmarie
Completely gone for me, on Firefox but also on Edge.
173SandyAMcPherson
>171 PawsforThought: I noticed changes are happening rapid-fire today.
Maybe the hamsters are running full tilt!
Maybe the hamsters are running full tilt!
176andyl
>170 lilithcat: Same on Chrome
I think in general that there is too much whitespace when reading a topic I have had a play around and a couple of CSS rules makes it more acceptable to me. When things settle down I will add them as a rule to my machine and share them.
I am not sure I like the Save Message | Preview | Cancel being vertically aligned on my machine - which has tons of pixels from left to right, but it probably works better for a mobile. Could that be more responsive so that people on computers and laptops have the links (they are no longer styled as buttons) all on the same line?
I think in general that there is too much whitespace when reading a topic I have had a play around and a couple of CSS rules makes it more acceptable to me. When things settle down I will add them as a rule to my machine and share them.
I am not sure I like the Save Message | Preview | Cancel being vertically aligned on my machine - which has tons of pixels from left to right, but it probably works better for a mobile. Could that be more responsive so that people on computers and laptops have the links (they are no longer styled as buttons) all on the same line?
177karenmarie
I can't preview a post on Firefox, but can on Edge.
Here's a fun newproblem issue - feature? - all text I have enclosed within blockquote displays as a larger font size. This is on Firefox and Edge.
Here's a fun new
179andyl
>176 andyl:
The styling as buttons and with a horizontal alignment works in Chrome. It doesn't in FF 81.0.2 (updated version today) on Windows. So it is a browser related issue.
The styling as buttons and with a horizontal alignment works in Chrome. It doesn't in FF 81.0.2 (updated version today) on Windows. So it is a browser related issue.
181norabelle414
On a smartphone in portrait mode, when viewing a Topic page there's a slight left-right scroll. It only scrolls past white space, so I can see all of the text no matter which side I scroll to, but it's a bit annoying.
182reconditereader
The Talk page does look some better this morning, so thank you. I'm sure you are all working very hard.
I still wish the font weren't so faint!
I still wish the font weren't so faint!
183andyl
OK on the highlighting issue it seems that there is a ::selection pseudo-element styled as
::selection {
xbackground: var(--lt-warning-background-color);
text-shadow: none;
}
xbackground is being overridden by another rule somewhere.
In FF and Chrome the background-color must be specifed because I think that rule falls back to inherit (and well ::selection doesn't really have an ancestor to inherit from). Adding background-colour into the rule gets the selected text to show.
TBH as I don't think text-shadow is used anywhere I am not sure why the ::selection rule is there in the first place.
::selection {
xbackground: var(--lt-warning-background-color);
text-shadow: none;
}
xbackground is being overridden by another rule somewhere.
In FF and Chrome the background-color must be specifed because I think that rule falls back to inherit (and well ::selection doesn't really have an ancestor to inherit from). Adding background-colour into the rule gets the selected text to show.
TBH as I don't think text-shadow is used anywhere I am not sure why the ::selection rule is there in the first place.
184kristilabrie
>183 andyl: Excellent, passing this along to conceptDawg.
185andyl
>184 kristilabrie:
I guess you all are Mac people right? It looks like a lot of the issues are people using FF/Chrome
I guess you all are Mac people right? It looks like a lot of the issues are people using FF/Chrome
186lorax
I'm not sure what those two things have to do with each other? Many of the people having issues have specifically said we're using Macs.
187andyl
>186 lorax:
Some of those issues are just design decisions - whitespace, font choices, color choices etc. Apart from spoilers everything else seemed to work in Safari for SandyAMcPherson. They did say lots was wrong when they used Firefox. If there were other Mac users saying that lots of things didn't work I didn't see them. So it seems to me likely that LT staff use Macs and use Safari - as many of the issues discussed in this thread would obviously have been picked up as issues otherwise (spoilers may not have been noticed though).
Some of those issues are just design decisions - whitespace, font choices, color choices etc. Apart from spoilers everything else seemed to work in Safari for SandyAMcPherson. They did say lots was wrong when they used Firefox. If there were other Mac users saying that lots of things didn't work I didn't see them. So it seems to me likely that LT staff use Macs and use Safari - as many of the issues discussed in this thread would obviously have been picked up as issues otherwise (spoilers may not have been noticed though).
188lorax
andyl:
I think your implicit assumption that using a Mac meant using Safari escaped me. I'm definitely a Mac person and never use Safari.
I think your implicit assumption that using a Mac meant using Safari escaped me. I'm definitely a Mac person and never use Safari.
189timspalding
We made some changes to the main Talk page. There was a certain miscommunication and all of it got pushed before the whole LT team could approve it. But it's live now, so I guess I want your views. The changes include:
1. Less padding and whitespace generally, achieved by putting the name and date on the same line and generally tightening up.
2. Red select is gone, replaced by a light yellow.
3. The background color for read/unread is gone. Topics with unread messages are bold. I have also reverted to "X Unread" from "X New." This puts it back the way it was before the change.
Let me know what you think?
1. Less padding and whitespace generally, achieved by putting the name and date on the same line and generally tightening up.
2. Red select is gone, replaced by a light yellow.
3. The background color for read/unread is gone. Topics with unread messages are bold. I have also reverted to "X Unread" from "X New." This puts it back the way it was before the change.
Let me know what you think?
190ScarletBea
>189 timspalding:
1. Great, that's what I meant, now it looks MUCH better!
2. Strange, I'm in Chrome and see it as kinda pink-ish/salmon; not the bright deep red from before but definitely not yellow either
3. Not bothered :)
ETA: I like the option of having the Group name as a proper/separate column, but like someone mentioned before, it's a bit counter-intuitive that if you click just on the group name it goes to the thread instead of the group (as it feels separate). Would it be something difficult to change?
1. Great, that's what I meant, now it looks MUCH better!
2. Strange, I'm in Chrome and see it as kinda pink-ish/salmon; not the bright deep red from before but definitely not yellow either
3. Not bothered :)
ETA: I like the option of having the Group name as a proper/separate column, but like someone mentioned before, it's a bit counter-intuitive that if you click just on the group name it goes to the thread instead of the group (as it feels separate). Would it be something difficult to change?
191kristilabrie
>185 andyl: We are a Mac team at LT, but I use Chrome and am having the same highlight issues.
192proximity1
... "I'm in Chrome™"...
Well, there's your problem, then.
________________________
Right--Select/Highlight text (or other object) isn't supported (in the sense of being apparent/visible--it does still operate but you can't "see" that it's in effect) in your new Beta-version while, if you notice, at other webpages which haven't undergone these "improvements", the "Select/Highlight text" "works" just as usual.
Well, there's your problem, then.
________________________
Right--Select/Highlight text (or other object) isn't supported (in the sense of being apparent/visible--it does still operate but you can't "see" that it's in effect) in your new Beta-version while, if you notice, at other webpages which haven't undergone these "improvements", the "Select/Highlight text" "works" just as usual.
193norabelle414
Talk page updates - On a computer, Talk page looks way better now!!!
- love the yellow highlight color
- love that the last message username and timestamp is bigger now, though I still miss being able to click on the username to go to their profile
- much better amount of white space
- love the yellow highlight color
- love that the last message username and timestamp is bigger now, though I still miss being able to click on the username to go to their profile
- much better amount of white space
195usertesting101
The book was good.
197JacobHolt
>189 timspalding: Thanks, these are good changes (especially the "tightening up" in change #1)!
198casvelyn
>189 timspalding:
1. Good
2. GREAT!
3. I prefer the combination of background color and bold for unread threads. It made skimming much easier.
I've noticed that if the last poster on a thread has a long username, it runs over the "X" and practically off the edge of the page.
1. Good
2. GREAT!
3. I prefer the combination of background color and bold for unread threads. It made skimming much easier.
I've noticed that if the last poster on a thread has a long username, it runs over the "X" and practically off the edge of the page.
199timspalding
>108 kac522:
Yes. Thanks. We're looking at it. The column widths are absolutely sized, for reasons we don't want to change. So I think we'll need to elipsis especially long ones.
I'd argue for date-then-user, not what we have now. Opinions desired.
Yes. Thanks. We're looking at it. The column widths are absolutely sized, for reasons we don't want to change. So I think we'll need to elipsis especially long ones.
I'd argue for date-then-user, not what we have now. Opinions desired.
200lilithcat
>189 timspalding:
1. It does look better now, thanks, Tim.
2. Ochre. ;-)
Still can't highlight text or preview posts.
1. It does look better now, thanks, Tim.
2. Ochre. ;-)
Still can't highlight text or preview posts.
201lilithcat
>192 proximity1:
That would be true if the problem appeared only in Chrome, but I'm using Firefox and cannot highlight.
That would be true if the problem appeared only in Chrome, but I'm using Firefox and cannot highlight.
202conceptDawg
Highlighting should be fixed for you now. As are spoilers.
204mart1n
>202 conceptDawg: Highlighting looks good, cheers!
205casvelyn
>199 timspalding: I prefer date first, because if I'm looking at that column, I'm typically more interested in date than user, and it's harder to process the date when it's not aligned vertically.
I'm a speed-reader though, so I lean toward anything that allows me to read faster, regardless of whether it's useful to anyone else.
I'm a speed-reader though, so I lean toward anything that allows me to read faster, regardless of whether it's useful to anyone else.
206amanda4242
>199 timspalding: I actually like user then date. I'm more interested in who posted than when they did.
207Bookmarque
So a question - we can collapse the group column on the far left and push that info into the topic section, but when the group column is displayed, what is it for if it can't be sorted?
I will leave it collapsed since it basically doesn't do anything. If it could sort by group that would be useful.
Other than that, still figuring things out.
I hate is that there are two side bars. I feel like the info could be consolidated into one leaving more space for the talk column itself.
I will leave it collapsed since it basically doesn't do anything. If it could sort by group that would be useful.
Other than that, still figuring things out.
I hate is that there are two side bars. I feel like the info could be consolidated into one leaving more space for the talk column itself.
208lycomayflower
>189 timspalding: Talk looks so much better on my laptop now. Thank you!
I still find the size on my phone (Android) annoying large. I just can't see enough threads on the main page all at once. Once I click through into a single thread, it's better, but there's so much white space on the right that I'm pinching and resizing and recentering to read. Which I was doing before the change. I may very well get used to it and not care in a bit, but at the moment, I feel like I'll be using my laptop rather than my phone to look at Talk because of this, which is kind of counter productive given what you're trying to do here.
I still find the size on my phone (Android) annoying large. I just can't see enough threads on the main page all at once. Once I click through into a single thread, it's better, but there's so much white space on the right that I'm pinching and resizing and recentering to read. Which I was doing before the change. I may very well get used to it and not care in a bit, but at the moment, I feel like I'll be using my laptop rather than my phone to look at Talk because of this, which is kind of counter productive given what you're trying to do here.
209ScarletBea
You can never please everyone hehe, I just look at date/time last posted and don't really care who did it
ETA: I just noticed that when reading Talk on my (android) tablet, if it's in landscape mode I can see all columns as in my laptop, but in portrait the last column with date/user never appears (there's no scrolling option). I don't mind myself, but I wonder if it's a problem for others.
ETA: I just noticed that when reading Talk on my (android) tablet, if it's in landscape mode I can see all columns as in my laptop, but in portrait the last column with date/user never appears (there's no scrolling option). I don't mind myself, but I wonder if it's a problem for others.
210conceptDawg
>207 Bookmarque: Two sidebars
There have always been two sidebars within talk messages.
People want to quickly jump back into various talk "domains" without having to go back to the top of Talk (so we need the left sidebar for that navigation). The right sidebar is meta-information about the current topic (Touchstones, abouts, mentions, actions you can take on the whole thread, group information for this thread).
There have always been two sidebars within talk messages.
People want to quickly jump back into various talk "domains" without having to go back to the top of Talk (so we need the left sidebar for that navigation). The right sidebar is meta-information about the current topic (Touchstones, abouts, mentions, actions you can take on the whole thread, group information for this thread).
211conceptDawg
>208 lycomayflower: Android
I'm still working on Android issues today.
I'm still working on Android issues today.
212Bookmarque
Yes, I know there have always been two, but now they seem to be intrusive and squish the talk column down too much. If they scrolled with the talk posts they would maybe serve a purpose other than taking up space, but they don't so with the new format they seem more of a waste than before.
213LolaWalser
>199 timspalding:
Prefer "user first date second" by far. The user's identity always has value, time/date hardly ever (at least in how I use Talk).
The change seems to be going well. Slightly reverting closer to the old look (less white space) helps.
The yellow select is better although I could do without it very well. I'm trying to keep my cursor to the side and not trigger the select until I want to click on something.
I have no problem with the sidebars and like that they are fixed.
Random note: the number of "people on site now" is gone--what will the people in the "maximum posters seen" game thread do? :)
Prefer "user first date second" by far. The user's identity always has value, time/date hardly ever (at least in how I use Talk).
The change seems to be going well. Slightly reverting closer to the old look (less white space) helps.
The yellow select is better although I could do without it very well. I'm trying to keep my cursor to the side and not trigger the select until I want to click on something.
I have no problem with the sidebars and like that they are fixed.
Random note: the number of "people on site now" is gone--what will the people in the "maximum posters seen" game thread do? :)
214NinieB
>210 conceptDawg:
People want to quickly jump back into various talk "domains" without having to go back to the top of Talk
Am I missing something? I always have to go back to the top to access information in the sidebars.
People want to quickly jump back into various talk "domains" without having to go back to the top of Talk
Am I missing something? I always have to go back to the top to access information in the sidebars.
215SandyAMcPherson
>189 timspalding: Re additional changes: Thank you!
1. Super - love it.
2. The yellow is so much less aggressive. Perfect fix for me.
3. Thank goodness. A great improvement.
And I used spoiler tags successfully on both FireFox and Safari browsers (Mac OS).
Kudos to the Devs. They must have been working all night!
1. Super - love it.
2. The yellow is so much less aggressive. Perfect fix for me.
3. Thank goodness. A great improvement.
And I used spoiler tags successfully on both FireFox and Safari browsers (Mac OS).
Kudos to the Devs. They must have been working all night!
216amanda4242
>210 conceptDawg: People want to quickly jump back into various talk "domains" without having to go back to the top of Talk
Amend that to some people. I've never wanted it and would like the option to collapse the left sidebar.
Amend that to some people. I've never wanted it and would like the option to collapse the left sidebar.
217shadrach_anki
>214 NinieB:
The left-hand sidebar stays fixed and does not scroll in the new Talk format. The behavior of the right-hand sidebar varies, depending on how many touchstones are being used in a thread. So with this thread, both sidebars should be fixed, regardless of what posts you are viewing. In a reading journal-type thread with lots of touchstones, the right sidebar will scroll along with the posts.
The left-hand sidebar stays fixed and does not scroll in the new Talk format. The behavior of the right-hand sidebar varies, depending on how many touchstones are being used in a thread. So with this thread, both sidebars should be fixed, regardless of what posts you are viewing. In a reading journal-type thread with lots of touchstones, the right sidebar will scroll along with the posts.
218gabriel
>189 timspalding:
1 - Excellent. I think I was first in to suggest unstacking name & date, so thank you very much. I'd be curious if name/date might look better in a slightly smaller font - that was one of the merits when stacked - it looked more like technical data, which it is.
2 - I prefer the light yellow. I feel like there's a better colour out there, but I don't want to make the perfect the enemy of the good.
3 - Much better. I kind of liked "x new" but I suppose it really doesn't matter.
Also - thanks for rounding the corners on the Talk interface. It looks more approachable now.
1 - Excellent. I think I was first in to suggest unstacking name & date, so thank you very much. I'd be curious if name/date might look better in a slightly smaller font - that was one of the merits when stacked - it looked more like technical data, which it is.
2 - I prefer the light yellow. I feel like there's a better colour out there, but I don't want to make the perfect the enemy of the good.
3 - Much better. I kind of liked "x new" but I suppose it really doesn't matter.
Also - thanks for rounding the corners on the Talk interface. It looks more approachable now.
219lycomayflower
>211 conceptDawg: Ah HA. It definitely looks different on Android today than it did yesterday, so I thought it was done. Cool.
220timspalding
>210 conceptDawg: There have always been two sidebars within talk messages.
Part of the reasoning here is that text isn't readable if it stretches too far. See https://baymard.com/blog/line-length-readability for some work on the subject. At its MOST squeezed, LT Talk is around 90 characters per line—twice the recommendation.
Part of the reasoning here is that text isn't readable if it stretches too far. See https://baymard.com/blog/line-length-readability for some work on the subject. At its MOST squeezed, LT Talk is around 90 characters per line—twice the recommendation.
221ffortsa
Thanks for the sort by topic. And I find it is a bit more compact so more of my topics fit on one page. Much obliged.
222conceptDawg
>212 Bookmarque:
The sidebars actually DO scroll with the posts. But only if there isn't enough room for them to fit on screen. If they fit on screen completely there isn't a need for them to scroll. This is another improvement, by the way. Before, you HAD to scroll to the top of the screen to select another Talk area. Now you can do that without scrolling if your screen is big enough to fit the sidebar content on screen.
The sidebars actually DO scroll with the posts. But only if there isn't enough room for them to fit on screen. If they fit on screen completely there isn't a need for them to scroll. This is another improvement, by the way. Before, you HAD to scroll to the top of the screen to select another Talk area. Now you can do that without scrolling if your screen is big enough to fit the sidebar content on screen.
223conceptDawg
Various bugs on Android have been fixed. Spacing of the main Topic table, menu clicking, posting, etc.
I can post just fine on my multiple android devices, so if you are still having problems posting in talk let me know (via email—I'm just 'chris' at librarything.com—or even profile comment, since you might not have another device to post a followup on Talk).
I can post just fine on my multiple android devices, so if you are still having problems posting in talk let me know (via email—I'm just 'chris' at librarything.com—or even profile comment, since you might not have another device to post a followup on Talk).
224Bookmarque
>222 conceptDawg: Hm. I run a 17" laptop and see just blank space on either side of my screen as I'm down to this 200+ message. I have to go to the top to select another area because they didn't scroll down with me. Are we talking past each other?
226quondame
>206 amanda4242: I agree. If it's at the top it likely to be recent so time is partially implied anyway.
227AndreasJ
>189 timspalding:
1) Like the reduction in whitespace.
2) Don't really see the need for the highlight at all, but the new colour is better than the old.
3) Like it better this way.
Regarding name and date, I'm more often interested in who posted last than when they did it.
(Pony: automatically mark a thread as read when all unread posts are by tombstoned users.)
1) Like the reduction in whitespace.
2) Don't really see the need for the highlight at all, but the new colour is better than the old.
3) Like it better this way.
Regarding name and date, I'm more often interested in who posted last than when they did it.
(Pony: automatically mark a thread as read when all unread posts are by tombstoned users.)
228lorax
Bookmarque (#224):
I was really confused, and did a bit of experimentation and figured out that the "room" here is vertical. Make your window sufficiently short so that the full height of the sidebars doesn't fit, and the sidebar content will scroll (and keep scrolling past the bottom of the sidebar, until it reaches the "empty space" scenario in your screenshot). I need to make my window considerably smaller than my 15" laptop screen to reach this point; are you full-screen on that 17"?
I was really confused, and did a bit of experimentation and figured out that the "room" here is vertical. Make your window sufficiently short so that the full height of the sidebars doesn't fit, and the sidebar content will scroll (and keep scrolling past the bottom of the sidebar, until it reaches the "empty space" scenario in your screenshot). I need to make my window considerably smaller than my 15" laptop screen to reach this point; are you full-screen on that 17"?
229lorax
Crypto-Willobie (#161):
Actually the new red, where I see it, looks more cranberry or burgundy rather than gory.
We're at the point of both individual perceptions and monitor settings, but to me it's much too brown to be either cranberry or burgundy (both of which are purplish to me). It is dried blood rather than fresh, though, on the "gory" scale. Now that they've changed the highlight color on Talk, the main offender is in starred topics, to the point that I may need to un-star them to get those horrible red stars off my Talk page.
Actually the new red, where I see it, looks more cranberry or burgundy rather than gory.
We're at the point of both individual perceptions and monitor settings, but to me it's much too brown to be either cranberry or burgundy (both of which are purplish to me). It is dried blood rather than fresh, though, on the "gory" scale. Now that they've changed the highlight color on Talk, the main offender is in starred topics, to the point that I may need to un-star them to get those horrible red stars off my Talk page.
231Bookmarque
You're right, lorax, it does scroll until it's empty. It's the 'not-new-but-newly-annoying' emptiness that is making me a bit puzzled. I would like them to follow me down as I scroll or just go away so the talk section is wider. No idea why it didn't bother me before. Probably because it wasn't new. 🤣
And I like the red. Very sad my internet connection went down yesterday so I couldn't see it. Yellow is so...common.
And I like the red. Very sad my internet connection went down yesterday so I couldn't see it. Yellow is so...common.
232Collectorator
Medlemmem har stängts av.
233johnsimpson
Hi Tim, love the new format apart from the lack of information about the number of books recorded and members online on the bottom of the threads for number of Librarything members online, we need this information to post otherwise our threads are disrupted.
Hope this can be rectified for us.
Hope this can be rectified for us.
234timspalding
>233 johnsimpson:
All other pages have it, though. Work pages, etc. We can talk about putting it somewhere else, but for now 90% of the pages of the site have it.
T
All other pages have it, though. Work pages, etc. We can talk about putting it somewhere else, but for now 90% of the pages of the site have it.
T
235conceptDawg
>224 Bookmarque:
It depends on the height of the screen and if the sidenavs are longer than the height of the screen. You want to be able to get to all of the the content of the sidenavs, so they are set to scroll with the page if they are taller than available screen space.
It depends on the height of the screen and if the sidenavs are longer than the height of the screen. You want to be able to get to all of the the content of the sidenavs, so they are set to scroll with the page if they are taller than available screen space.
236lilithcat
There is an issue with name/date overlapping the "x" on the far right of the Talk page.
237Helenliz
I like it better this evening than I did this morning. The red scolling was a bit violent for pre-first cup of coffee eyes (yes I do LT while the first one is brewing!). The paler colour works better.
Just the bold for threads with unread works better than having read in blue and the unread bolded. That looked too busy. I find the bolding easier to see on the black text of groups than the blue text of the thread title itself.
I've also been able to set the zoom on LT to the same I use for most other pages, which is useful, no need to keep switching it around. It's OK on Talk, but small on Your Books, but then I probably spend more time in Talk, so I'll survive.
In Book Discussions/Your Books view of Talk the subtitle of the thread highlighted with the mouse is white, which doesn't show up on the paler colour. Probably looked fine on the red earlier.
The Post message and Preview below where I'm currently typing this aren't buttons, they're just little blue text, one above the other, which doesn't stand out very well. Intentional? Would prefer a border and a button style view.
Just the bold for threads with unread works better than having read in blue and the unread bolded. That looked too busy. I find the bolding easier to see on the black text of groups than the blue text of the thread title itself.
I've also been able to set the zoom on LT to the same I use for most other pages, which is useful, no need to keep switching it around. It's OK on Talk, but small on Your Books, but then I probably spend more time in Talk, so I'll survive.
In Book Discussions/Your Books view of Talk the subtitle of the thread highlighted with the mouse is white, which doesn't show up on the paler colour. Probably looked fine on the red earlier.
The Post message and Preview below where I'm currently typing this aren't buttons, they're just little blue text, one above the other, which doesn't stand out very well. Intentional? Would prefer a border and a button style view.
238Bookmarque
>235 conceptDawg: But are we agreed that with a long topic thread you get blank spaces of nothing, right? You scroll past the sidebar content.
239jjwilson61
Why can't I use two fingers to zoom in on my Android phone in the talk threads? When people post screen shots I can't see what they're trying to show.
240NinieB
>235 conceptDawg: I would prefer to be able to separately scroll the right sidenav (touchstones).
241amanda4242
I like the little icon that shows that a thread is dormant, but when I hover over it says "Topic Archived"; shouldn't a dormant thread say it's dormant rather than archived?
242japaul22
I like the changes. Even in the limited amount of time I've had to spend with it, I already think the old format that is still on the front page and when you click on an individual group looks dated. Will you be changing the group pages to this look as well?
243ulmannc
>45 timspalding: I still don't see the changes to reduce the spacing between lines somewhat back to the old style and same with the font. There were some changes suggested in line 189 but I sure don't see them. It still looks the same as the sample you have up at 45.
245timspalding
The desktop view is now alive:
246amanda4242
>245 timspalding: Is there a difference between the two views?
247timspalding
>246 amanda4242:
There is if you're on a small screen. I'm talking to conceptDawg about removing it as an option when the screen is large, because then there's no effect. Are you using mobile?
There is if you're on a small screen. I'm talking to conceptDawg about removing it as an option when the screen is large, because then there's no effect. Are you using mobile?
248amanda4242
>247 timspalding: No, I'm on a laptop with about an 11" screen.
249aspirit
>246 amanda4242: I already had screenshots ready, so here are the difference on my (Android) smartphone: the layout and available information on the screen at one time.
The colors aren't the default because everything is in my browser's dark mode for my own (something like) wellbeing.
Mobile view:
LT's official desktop view:
My browser's desktop view:
(Sorry for sloppy cropping at the top of the screenshots.)
As things are, I would likely have to switch between the mobile view and my mobile browser's desktop view. LT's official desktop view looks as if it would be better for tablets.
The colors aren't the default because everything is in my browser's dark mode for my own (something like) wellbeing.
Mobile view:
LT's official desktop view:
My browser's desktop view:
(Sorry for sloppy cropping at the top of the screenshots.)
As things are, I would likely have to switch between the mobile view and my mobile browser's desktop view. LT's official desktop view looks as if it would be better for tablets.
250amanda4242
>249 aspirit: Thanks for the screenshots. The Talk redesign looks like it's a great improvement for those who use mobile devices, but not so much for those on larger screens.
251aspirit
>250 amanda4242: I know my opinion isn't as valuable as someone who says they like the mobile designs common on the internet of late, but... I guess it's bothering me that the people who say the new design is great for mobile devices don't seem to be the regular users of the site on mobile devices.
I rarely use LT on any computer except my smartphone-- as a matter of accessibility, not because I prefer a tiny screen and mobile apps. I'm dependent on what's available to mobile users. I do not like the new mobile view. It's technically functional (most of the time) but difficult to use for scrolling or scanning quickly, finding information that's not at the top of the screen, and avoiding real headaches.
That said, with my browser's features, I think I'll be able to continue using the site. The design change isn't a great impairment (at the moment). I've experienced site redesigns in the past few years that were much worse. Also, possibly, something has improved that I haven't yet had a chance to appreciate.
ETA: The something is possibly the black-screen version. I previously wasn't using my browser's dark mode for LT. I am very grateful that, whether accidental or by design, the latest color scheme automatically translates well in this setting.
I rarely use LT on any computer except my smartphone-- as a matter of accessibility, not because I prefer a tiny screen and mobile apps. I'm dependent on what's available to mobile users. I do not like the new mobile view. It's technically functional (most of the time) but difficult to use for scrolling or scanning quickly, finding information that's not at the top of the screen, and avoiding real headaches.
That said, with my browser's features, I think I'll be able to continue using the site. The design change isn't a great impairment (at the moment). I've experienced site redesigns in the past few years that were much worse. Also, possibly, something has improved that I haven't yet had a chance to appreciate.
ETA: The something is possibly the black-screen version. I previously wasn't using my browser's dark mode for LT. I am very grateful that, whether accidental or by design, the latest color scheme automatically translates well in this setting.
252aspirit
>49 conceptDawg: by the way, yeah, I can post again! Thank you.
253YouKneeK
>202 conceptDawg: A million thanks for the fixed spoiler tags. My reading journal thread looks much more decent now without all those naked spoilers exposing themselves.
I haven’t seen a note that it’s fixed for Firefox, so you all are probably still aware of it, but I wanted to note just in case that the Preview function still appears to be broken on Firefox.
I still really miss being able to see the stars in the topic list in Talk on my Android. Is it an oversight, a bug, or the intended new world? I realize I can switch to view only starred posts and read them separately, but I want to go through all unread posts sequentially and just see the star where I need the reminder to pay extra attention. I can’t tell they’re starred until I read to the bottom of the thread which is too late.
When I was annoyed by the missing stars, I figured I’d go back to using the Talk module on my home page since they still show there. I usually only use this module when I have less than 10 topics with new messages, so that they all show on the first page. Otherwise I go to the full Talk page. On the module, I find it too easy to miss things if a new post shuffles the posts on the pages down while I’m switching pages, plus that little “next” button is a bit difficult to touch safely on mobile.
So anyway, when I tried to use the Talk module, I noticed that the prev | next links were getting cut off. You can touch "nex” on the first page (1st screen below), but on the second page (2nd screen below) all you can see is the “prev |” and so you can’t progress any further through the pages.
Finally, I would just like to point out that you could solve the star color controversy by giving us multiple star colors to use for multiple purposes. ;) Then people could use the colors they like and not the ones they don’t.(Hoping nobody will realize that then there will be controversy about which color should be the default…)
I haven’t seen a note that it’s fixed for Firefox, so you all are probably still aware of it, but I wanted to note just in case that the Preview function still appears to be broken on Firefox.
I still really miss being able to see the stars in the topic list in Talk on my Android. Is it an oversight, a bug, or the intended new world? I realize I can switch to view only starred posts and read them separately, but I want to go through all unread posts sequentially and just see the star where I need the reminder to pay extra attention. I can’t tell they’re starred until I read to the bottom of the thread which is too late.
When I was annoyed by the missing stars, I figured I’d go back to using the Talk module on my home page since they still show there. I usually only use this module when I have less than 10 topics with new messages, so that they all show on the first page. Otherwise I go to the full Talk page. On the module, I find it too easy to miss things if a new post shuffles the posts on the pages down while I’m switching pages, plus that little “next” button is a bit difficult to touch safely on mobile.
So anyway, when I tried to use the Talk module, I noticed that the prev | next links were getting cut off. You can touch "nex” on the first page (1st screen below), but on the second page (2nd screen below) all you can see is the “prev |” and so you can’t progress any further through the pages.
Finally, I would just like to point out that you could solve the star color controversy by giving us multiple star colors to use for multiple purposes. ;) Then people could use the colors they like and not the ones they don’t.
254timspalding
>253 YouKneeK:
I still really miss being able to see the stars in the topic list in Talk on my Android.
Oversight, I believe. Asking conceptDawg.
I still really miss being able to see the stars in the topic list in Talk on my Android.
Oversight, I believe. Asking conceptDawg.
255conceptDawg
>249 aspirit: It looks like your browser's desktop view is doing the same thing we are except I'm just picking a slightly larger screen resolution for "desktop mode." We're using 961px wide to simulate desktop views so that it trips our 960 tablet breakpoint into desktop sizes.
It also approximates a typical desktop view a little more since it's the size we drop the right sidenav due to restricted space on many pages.
Your browser is likely using 768px(+/- a couple), which is still considered "mobile" to most web folks because most newer phones (iPhone X, Pixel, etc) are 768. It is our breakpoint for mobile as well.
I experimented with multiple sizes before settling on the 961 number as a happy medium.
It also approximates a typical desktop view a little more since it's the size we drop the right sidenav due to restricted space on many pages.
Your browser is likely using 768px(+/- a couple), which is still considered "mobile" to most web folks because most newer phones (iPhone X, Pixel, etc) are 768. It is our breakpoint for mobile as well.
I experimented with multiple sizes before settling on the 961 number as a happy medium.
256humouress
I’m not seeing the last posters’ names on threads on my iPhone 6 this evening though I saw them this morning on my iPad Air. (Singapore time, about half a day ahead of US East Coast) I tried scrolling to the right but it doesn’t move.
257lauralkeet
>254 timspalding: Just FYI, I can't see the stars in the Talk Topic List on iPhone either.
258Helenliz
Should users removed as spam have the contents of their spammy posts visible?
Example: https://www.librarything.com/topic/3635#7034584
Final post, the user has been removed for spam, yet their post is fully visible.
Example: https://www.librarything.com/topic/3635#7034584
Final post, the user has been removed for spam, yet their post is fully visible.
259kristilabrie
>258 Helenliz: ETA: never mind, I see that it didn't have enough flags before per https://www.librarything.com/topic/324352#7290201.
This is what I'm seeing:
Do you see the same, or something different?
Do you see the same, or something different?
260karenmarie
>189 timspalding:, >202 conceptDawg: Windows 10 laptop, Firefox at zoom 100% and Edge at zoom 100%, Talk main page - both are pleasing and have returned the functionality I was used to. Thank you!
Message Preview – working on Edge but not on Firefox.
Blockquote still displaying larger font than rest of message for both.
Highlighting and Spoilers working for both.
>199 timspalding: I like usename/date for Last Poster but can see how changing it could make sense. Since we can’t click on the user from Talk anymore, it is moot for me. That's a minor point, though. I'm just pleased to get header sorting and non-stacked Last Message back.
Message Preview – working on Edge but not on Firefox.
Blockquote still displaying larger font than rest of message for both.
Highlighting and Spoilers working for both.
>199 timspalding: I like usename/date for Last Poster but can see how changing it could make sense. Since we can’t click on the user from Talk anymore, it is moot for me. That's a minor point, though. I'm just pleased to get header sorting and non-stacked Last Message back.
261norabelle414
I like the strikethrough for spam posters on the Talk main page. The tombstone was cute and I'll miss it (RIP tombstone) but I think the strikethrough is more obvious.
263bragan
I just wanted to say, I'm usually one of the first in line to grumble about how everything is designed for mobile these days without caring how it looks for those of us with bigger screens, with way too much whitespace everywhere and etc, etc. But I think the new talk pages look really good on my laptop and desktop screens. And it's going to take a little bit of getting used to, but the new posts list is definitely much better on my aging eyes.
(Like others, though, I would kind of rather have buttons for "Post message" and "Preview" than just the little text. And did there not used to be an option to "cancel," or am I imagining that?)
(Like others, though, I would kind of rather have buttons for "Post message" and "Preview" than just the little text. And did there not used to be an option to "cancel," or am I imagining that?)
264Tanya-dogearedcopy
I feel like I'm not seeing what everyone else is seeing but I'll add my two cents anyway:
I'm on an iPhone 7 (web-site/not app) and a MacPro 2018 laptop:
On both platforms, the font seems finer, making even boded items more challenging to discern and;
While the space composition on the iPhone presents well, on the laptop, there is a lot of white space.
Overall it looks more elegant, just a little more difficult for me to read.
I'm on an iPhone 7 (web-site/not app) and a MacPro 2018 laptop:
On both platforms, the font seems finer, making even boded items more challenging to discern and;
While the space composition on the iPhone presents well, on the laptop, there is a lot of white space.
Overall it looks more elegant, just a little more difficult for me to read.
265conceptDawg
>263 bragan: Those buttons were a bug, now fixed.
266jjwilson61
As someone who can only access the site on my phone for the time being I appreciate this redesign immensely. It's a vast improvement over the previous layout where I had to constantly zoom in and out.
I can't wait to see what you do with the Add Books and the Your Books screens.
I can't wait to see what you do with the Add Books and the Your Books screens.
267conceptDawg
>264 Tanya-dogearedcopy:
We are currently using the default system font for your system.
So it's the same font used everywhere in Mac OS and iOS for everything (ideally San Francisco, but that depends on your system version). The same holds true for Android users, albeit a different font (Roboto for most of the system versions).
We are currently using the default system font for your system.
So it's the same font used everywhere in Mac OS and iOS for everything (ideally San Francisco, but that depends on your system version). The same holds true for Android users, albeit a different font (Roboto for most of the system versions).
268bragan
>265 conceptDawg: Yay! Less than an hour after I complained about them. Now, that's what I call service. ;)
269waltzmn
I don't use Talk enough to really have a full vote -- maybe half a vote. :-) Viewing on a desktop. I feel like I'd want the ability to sort by topic, but I don't use it enough to have an opinion.
Regarding whitespace: I grant that the old way was too crowded, especially on small screens, but this is too loose. As I scroll through this on a laptop, I typically see three or four messages at a time, no more. This isn't enough to get the sense of a thread, or to view full context. And you don't need a FULL line of space between items. Maybe cut it down to about eight points?
If it's possible, I'd also like to have a few more controls in the message headers. Not just a "go to top" but a "go to bottom" (or "go to newest"), and maybe one for seeing other posts by that particular poster. You have lots of space in the blue bar; let's use it. :-)
Regarding whitespace: I grant that the old way was too crowded, especially on small screens, but this is too loose. As I scroll through this on a laptop, I typically see three or four messages at a time, no more. This isn't enough to get the sense of a thread, or to view full context. And you don't need a FULL line of space between items. Maybe cut it down to about eight points?
If it's possible, I'd also like to have a few more controls in the message headers. Not just a "go to top" but a "go to bottom" (or "go to newest"), and maybe one for seeing other posts by that particular poster. You have lots of space in the blue bar; let's use it. :-)
271rosalita
>270 mnleona: Do you mean in the topic list? I still see an X at the far right of each line, but it's a white X in a very light gray circle so it's very easy to overlook.
272aspirit
I'm not sure why, but suddenly, the Talk section on my Home page looks better (ETA: still only in Night mode, as I can't see anything clearly in the site default).
The text below "Post message" also looks better, so I'm guessing the dev team is counting to improve what was pushed out to us earlier this week. (The text continues to push up into the buttons sometimes.)
Whatever tweaks were made that made things better-- thank you.
Whatever tweaks were made that made things better-- thank you.
273quondame
>262 timspalding: 😔 But it was perfect.
274gabriel
A couple more design notes:
I count about ten different fonts/font sizes/font styles on this page. Simplify, simplify. The "Touchstones" in the message box is different from the "Touchstones" in the right-hand margin, even though they are both serif headers. Similarly, there's no reason to have a heavier font for the text below "Group:New Features" than below "About" in the right-hand margin.
The categories in the left-hand margin ("LibraryThing", "Your World", "Book Discussions" look like a different font than anything else on the page. Maybe the serif headers wouldn't work there (I'd like to see them, though), but they're sort of design orphans atm.
Secondly, I think the talk threads might be tightened up a little: there's a fair bit of a gap both before & after the Reply | More line which could be reduced.
I count about ten different fonts/font sizes/font styles on this page. Simplify, simplify. The "Touchstones" in the message box is different from the "Touchstones" in the right-hand margin, even though they are both serif headers. Similarly, there's no reason to have a heavier font for the text below "Group:New Features" than below "About" in the right-hand margin.
The categories in the left-hand margin ("LibraryThing", "Your World", "Book Discussions" look like a different font than anything else on the page. Maybe the serif headers wouldn't work there (I'd like to see them, though), but they're sort of design orphans atm.
Secondly, I think the talk threads might be tightened up a little: there's a fair bit of a gap both before & after the Reply | More line which could be reduced.
276EllaTim
I sometimes use my mobile phone to read LT. The screen was really small, so I hoped LT would be able to make some kind of mobile layout.
I think the new layout is an improvement, but I do have some problems. I usually read with the screen in horizontal position, the font is just a bit larger, making for easier reading. But when I try to write a post I can't see a thing. All the writing space is swallowed up by the keyboard.
I then turn the phone to vertical, there is more writing space, but it is harder to read.
And I miss the touchstone, where is it?
I think the new layout is an improvement, but I do have some problems. I usually read with the screen in horizontal position, the font is just a bit larger, making for easier reading. But when I try to write a post I can't see a thing. All the writing space is swallowed up by the keyboard.
I then turn the phone to vertical, there is more writing space, but it is harder to read.
And I miss the touchstone, where is it?
277bragan
Hmm, this is interesting. I just noticed that if I hit "reply" to an individual message, I get the "Save Message," "Preview" and "Cancel" buttons, but if I use the "add a message" box at the bottom, I see "Post message" and "Preview" buttons. Shouldn't the two be consistent?
Well, I assume the lack of the "cancel" in the second case is due to the fact that the box just always hangs out down at the bottom there and you can't make it go away, but still. I think better of whatever I was about to say often enough that it might be nice to just be able to quickly bail out of whatever I started to write before I came to my senses. And "save message" as opposed to "post message" is just kind of confusing. My first association with "save" as an option, as opposed to "post" is apparently, "save as a draft without posting," which is clearly not the behavior here. That might just be me, though.
Well, I assume the lack of the "cancel" in the second case is due to the fact that the box just always hangs out down at the bottom there and you can't make it go away, but still. I think better of whatever I was about to say often enough that it might be nice to just be able to quickly bail out of whatever I started to write before I came to my senses. And "save message" as opposed to "post message" is just kind of confusing. My first association with "save" as an option, as opposed to "post" is apparently, "save as a draft without posting," which is clearly not the behavior here. That might just be me, though.
278kac522
The more I use the new talk pages, the more I like 'em. So much easier on the eyes. Thanks for all the hard work.
2792wonderY
Help! I can’t get back to viewing most recent posts. The page is showing old dormant threads. The topic button just compressed the header line so all I see is the group name. Unread messages choice is no longer an option on my phone unless I’m on the group page. This is awful.
280John5918
Now I'm getting used to the new Talk pages, they seem to be OK, probably also due to all the ongoing tweaking that is being done in response to people's concerns. I always find it difficult to get used to changes in online stuff. Thanks, everybody.
281annushka
The new Talk section has a very narrow Group column. Groups names are not able to fit there and they end up breaking up into multiple lines. Topics on the other hand are mostly one-liners and have empty second lines. Is there a way to resize and remove the Group column?
283kac522
Had a problem tonight: joined the newly created Group 2021 Category Challenge. From the main page I can see the list of threads and I can "star" my favorites.
But if I actually click on the thread itself, I can't figure out how to "star" or "unstar" the thread from within the thread.
Hope that makes sense. Of course, the Group page is the old LT and the individual threads are the New LT, so maybe some disconnect there.
But if I actually click on the thread itself, I can't figure out how to "star" or "unstar" the thread from within the thread.
Hope that makes sense. Of course, the Group page is the old LT and the individual threads are the New LT, so maybe some disconnect there.
284kac522
>283 kac522: Never mind, I found it way over on the right hand column. Seems to me it used to be in the center.
Suggestion: if the stars are going to be red in a list, then the icon to "star" the thread should be red, too. Or turn red when you star it--can't remember how it worked before, but I remember it turned gold when you "starred" it, just like in the lists. (I still prefer gold stars, but then I need all the encouragement I can get.)
Suggestion: if the stars are going to be red in a list, then the icon to "star" the thread should be red, too. Or turn red when you star it--can't remember how it worked before, but I remember it turned gold when you "starred" it, just like in the lists. (I still prefer gold stars, but then I need all the encouragement I can get.)
2852wonderY
>282 timspalding: That’s not visible/available on my iPhone (5, I think) using Safari, not the app.
Luckily, I brought my laptop with me and was able to reset from there.
How do you look up which phone you have?
Luckily, I brought my laptop with me and was able to reset from there.
How do you look up which phone you have?
286humouress
>285 2wonderY: Open the Settings app, scroll down to General and you should be able to see your model number.
2872wonderY
>286 humouress: Thanks! It’s an 8.
288AvaHudson0
Detta konto har stängts av för spammande.
289aspirit
The overly wide Unstar and Ignore buttons at the top of the sidebar that gets pushed to the bottom of the page on small screens are a little worrisome. They're in between the topic main content and the touchstones, which, are referenced far more often than the buttons need to be used for each topic.
I'm guessing accidental (un)stars and (un)ignores will be common if the button remain where they are.
I'm guessing accidental (un)stars and (un)ignores will be common if the button remain where they are.
290mnleona
>289 aspirit: Someone told me they are at the right side so I lowered my zoom and found them.
291humouress
Ooh; I like the way that the left side bar stays put so I don't have to find my way back up to the top of a page to navigate once I've posted a message on a thread.
292lauralkeet
>289 aspirit: seconding this.
>290 mnleona: Are you on a desktop? It doesn't work that way on my iPad. My browser (Chrome) is at its default zoom -- I don't even know how to change it -- and the unstar and ignore bars appear below the "add a message" box.
>290 mnleona: Are you on a desktop? It doesn't work that way on my iPad. My browser (Chrome) is at its default zoom -- I don't even know how to change it -- and the unstar and ignore bars appear below the "add a message" box.
293NinieB
If we could filter the main talk page, in whatever view we're looking at, to see only unread topics, I would use that happily. I frequently use the main talk page to find conversations I haven't read yet. It would be nice to be able to filter out the ones I've read.
294mnleona
I have a Samsung Chrome and an HP laptop computers and can lower the zoom on both. Someone with an I Pad could help. My daughter has an I Pad, I could ask her.
295jjwilson61
>294 mnleona: When the screen is narrow those buttons are at the bottom and when it's wide enough they're on the side. What you did by zooming out was to make the screen wider which caused the buttons to move from the bottom to the side.
296norabelle414
I'd like to reiterate what other people have mentioned: I really don't like it that the first message of a topic is marked as "read" even when this is your first time opening the topic. This makes it impossible to tell, once you open the topic, whether you have read the first message already or not.
297humouress
>292 lauralkeet: >294 mnleona: I use Safari on my iPad and zoom out using two fingers on the screen in a pinching movement and the opposite to zoom in, if that makes sense. Is that what you needed help with?
298mnleona
>295 jjwilson61: I was able to see the "X" an the right side when I changed the zoom. I was trying to help someone because someone helped me. I hope I did not confuse anyone.
299lauralkeet
>297 humouress: for whatever reason that doesn't work in Chrome. Google sent me to a Chrome for iPad help page, which instructed me to find a "More..." button at the lower right of my screen ... which does not exist. Sigh.
300annushka
>1 timspalding: Will there be an update to either make the Group column in the Talk portion of the page optional or remove it completely? Long group names and narrow column width create a lot of unnecessary white space and the whole section takes up too much space. I checked on Safari and Chrome on my Mac and it's the same in both browsers.
301jjwilson61
>300 annushka: There's a symbol just to the left of the word Topic in the header of the Talk page that will collapse the Group column.
302annushka
>301 jjwilson61: I don't see it.
303SandraArdnas
>302 annushka: Is this just a module on your homepage? There's a symbol with an arrow on the actual talk page. Perhaps it hasn't yet been implemented for the module, which also still has the Topic-Topic typo
304annushka
>303 SandraArdnas: Correct - I was talking about the module on the home page. Due to the recent change, it became very large with a lot of white spaces.
305jjwilson61
>304 annushka: In that case, I believe they're working on the Talk page first. After that they'll get to the Talk module on the Home page.
306annushka
>305 jjwilson61: Thanks! It makes sense to roll out updates in phases.
307timspalding
Just a quick note: conceptDawg is out on vacation this week, and I am taking a personal day. So I don't think any changes will get made or bugs will get fixed today. But I'll be bright-eyed and bushy-tailed tomorrow, ready to do both.
308kristilabrie
>277 bragan: You make valid points here, thanks! Making some notes for the developers.
309kristilabrie
>281 annushka: Where are you seeing the Group names using multiple lines? This shouldn't be anywhere in the actual Talk pages. If you're referring to the Talk module on your Homepage, nothing's been changed there yet and that will improve once the developers get there.
310kristilabrie
>279 2wonderY: I think I see what you're seeing! And yuck you're right. Will report the bugs to the developers, thanks.
311kristilabrie
>296 norabelle414: Completely valid concern. I would consider it a bug, imho. Passing this along to developers, thanks.
312annushka
>309 kristilabrie: I'm seeing it on the Home page. The Talk section used to be very condensed and did not take up as much space as it is taking up now due to the wrapping in the Groups column.
313PawsforThought
Alright, I’ve had some more time, and have had a look on mobile.
* Stars need to be brought back to the main Talk page (they’re currently missing on mobile)
* Star and ignore makes no sense at the bottom of the page, imho. Belongs at the top of the page.
* No red stars, please
* And I’ll reiterate that the colour choices for read and unread messages is not good. Blue makes more sense as “read”, since that’s how it works with links. The best would be darker (for unread) and lighter (for read) shade of the same colour, similar to how it used to be.
* Stars need to be brought back to the main Talk page (they’re currently missing on mobile)
* Star and ignore makes no sense at the bottom of the page, imho. Belongs at the top of the page.
* No red stars, please
* And I’ll reiterate that the colour choices for read and unread messages is not good. Blue makes more sense as “read”, since that’s how it works with links. The best would be darker (for unread) and lighter (for read) shade of the same colour, similar to how it used to be.
314jjwilson61
>313 PawsforThought: I'd argue that star and ignore should be both at the top and bottom. There are plenty of times I've read the last post in a thread and decided I didn't want to read any more.
3152wonderY
>310 kristilabrie: I did manage to make it appear, but I had to decrease font size to 50% and turn to landscape, which kinda fights against the stated goal of accessibility.
316lauralkeet
Bug: "Continue this topic in another topic" does not work.
The screen says "New Topic" and below that, the name of the group, and nothing else. You can't do anything on the page. (iPad, both Chrome and Safari).
The screen says "New Topic" and below that, the name of the group, and nothing else. You can't do anything on the page. (iPad, both Chrome and Safari).
318lauralkeet
>317 lilithcat: thank you.
319timspalding
>316 lauralkeet: working on now.
320timspalding
Okay, I have fixed the lack of "Continue this topic in another topic."
321lilithcat
>320 timspalding:
Good timing, because this topic was getting a bit slow to load!
So I will continue it.
Thanks for the fix.
Good timing, because this topic was getting a bit slow to load!
So I will continue it.
Thanks for the fix.
322datrappert
In Zeitgeist, largest libraries used to be numbered, so I could see my ranking easily. Now the numbers are gone. It would be great if all the Zeitgeist sections included the numbers (1, 2, 3...) as well as the userid and relevant statistic.
324cindydavid4
is there a way to have a delet button when editing an unwanted post?
also please move the star this button back to the top?
and thanks for fixing the red, as much as I love the color it was a little much
also please move the star this button back to the top?
and thanks for fixing the red, as much as I love the color it was a little much
Den här diskussionen fortsatte här: New Talk Pages #2